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GypsyDeath
Zapped Profile
3575 Posts |
 Posted - 04/18/2004 : 09:17:03
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Its always something that I ponder.Ive often thought about the things I buy, and eat, and use, and do, and other ways in which I could do them to benefit the environment - then I always think, but how would I make a difference?
Yeah sure, if everyone thought like this nothing would change, but, everyone is not suddenly going to all ego friendly.
There is a huge difference between humans and animals, yet, there are more similarities... it is almost as if people who lead their life by ego friendly rules are denying what they are. I think it has a lot to do with making yourself feel better. nothing wrong with that - who doesnt want to feel good about them selves?
Preaching is what I cant stand, you live your life, and let other live theirs.
Boys go to Jupiter, Get more stupider,
Girls go to Mars, Become rock stars
Wanna fuck and fight in the basement? |
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Adnan_le_Terrible
* Dog in the Sand *
France
1973 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 09:22:43
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quote:
Originally posted by El Barto
I am an animal lover.
Boycott cults
Well well, look who's coming out.
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GypsyDeath
Zapped Profile
3575 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 09:39:34
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haha! Jims a Kitty Splitter!!!!!!!!
err...hang on, thats not funny, i have two cats....
Boys go to Jupiter, Get more stupider,
Girls go to Mars, Become rock stars
Wanna fuck and fight in the basement? |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 10:25:35
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quote:
Dave Noisy Posted - 04/16/2004 : 11:37:22
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As for the tomato thing.. A tomato is not alive/conscious in any way.
If you look under anything under a microscope close enough, whether itīs an armchair or a tomato or your own hand, youīll see itīs just energy reduced to a superslow vibration. Energy is neither positive nor negative, it just is, which is why in this frequency range of the vast energy field we call a universe the energy that comprises me has no more or less a right to be here than the energy which comprises a tomato. Iīm sorry if you canīt experience feeling this.
--
"You one of those right-wing nut outfits?" inquired the diplomatic Metzger.
Fallopian twinkled. "They accuse us of being paranoids."
"They?" inquired Metzger, twinkling also.
"Us?" asked Oedipa.
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Edited by - Newo on 04/18/2004 10:48:02 |
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bumblebeeboy2
> Teenager of the Year <
United Kingdom
2638 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 10:31:48
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i was one of those people who always said "I could never be vegertarian" erm, then i met my current gf, and live with her... as people know, it's easier just to make one meal every night for each other, instead of making 2 completely seperate meals and making loads of washing up... so she's vegertarian, and as i tend not to eat properly anyway we share cooking, as motivation, so i no longer eat meat... well i do when we go out for a curry or chinese, but that's the only time when. and i really don't notice the difference. i miss pork chops a lot. and bacon sometimes, and chicken... but it's do-able... i quite like the quorn burgers now, more so than 'real' burgers, strangely... same for the mince... not sure what i was adding... but it's possible. i still miss meat... and i don't see much wrong with eating meat, although being a big hypocrite i'd never eat duck, frog, penquin or so on... ;) just pigs, cows, chickens and sheep. i never ate sea-food, hate it.
btw my gf is vegetarian because she doesn't like meat, it's not a decision based on what's wrong or right... and she insists on organic free-range eggs... which costs loads... 
The Shrine of the Sea Monkey!
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GypsyDeath
Zapped Profile
3575 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 10:32:17
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Also, personally, ive seen a lot of people / friends/family and myself that have become vegetarian or vegan for any peroid of time..well, its doesnt seem very healthy at all. Our bodies need to have all four food groups. at least. Thats how our bodies work - its evoloution baby!
SO yeah, I dotn know. maybe your bodies get used to it, but Personally, it doesnt seem very healthy.
Boys go to Jupiter, Get more stupider,
Girls go to Mars, Become rock stars
Wanna fuck and fight in the basement? |
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bumblebeeboy2
> Teenager of the Year <
United Kingdom
2638 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 10:38:45
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funny you should say that... i'm an ill kid most of the time... but a couple of recent blood tests have shown up as me being anaemic, in fact over the last 3 years i've been hovering over the border, sometimes anaemic, sometimes not... so everyone has been saying, oh it's because you don't eat meat... get some iron in you... some meat... so i asked the doctor and they said that alone can't be the reason... and that as long as i was eating things like mushrooms, i'm fine... you can get most if not all vitamins and stuff from non-meat foods, i *believe*.
The Shrine of the Sea Monkey!
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 13:48:22
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Oh boy..sucks being a minority on an MB...!
Jim and i discussed this more last night and i believe (?) we came to the agreement that one person CAND AND DOES make a difference.
As for the self-righteousness, that's based on the person. Being vegan isn't a self-righteous act. But people behave self-righteously. And without a doubt, there are more self-righteous meat-eaters than veggies. So either the person is self-righteous or not. Being vegan doesn't play a part in this, tho some people like to use this as a point against veganism, which is silly at best.
Derek - we never 'evolved from animals'. You've got the terminology wrong. We ARE animals. We haven't moved away from, beyond, or below the Animal Kingdom. We are animals, and will always be animals.
I find the theory of evolution relatively sound (esp. compared to creationism), and so i'd say we 'evolved' from a similar line as our ape and monkey cousins. Apl can prolly expand on this a little more. ;)
This has nothing to do with my morality tho - 'evolving' is not a form of 'superiority', except perhaps in the sense that we can function in the world better. It doesn't make us any better or worse than any other species.
Jim - *some* people raise *some* animals in their goal to create food. The chickens, pigs and cows certainly don't think of themselves as 'food'. And people like me don't think of them as 'food'. This supposed 'purpose' is an entirely human conception, and isn't actually a part of the reality of the situation.
Once conceptions change (as they are) so will the habits.
Adnan - i find the philosophy stuff interesting, but generally flawed and unusable in day-to-day life. If you wanted to sum up my philosophy, i'm opposed to speciesism (judging, or denying opportunity based on species, similar to sexism or racism) and believe that animals (human and non) should be able to live their lives free from the influence of humans.
It has been proven that to animals do exhibit self-awareness, they have their own languages to varying degrees. Descartes, tho brilliant in his day, can no longer really stand up to modern understanding of these relationships.
I believe it was him who also said that animals were 'automatons', basically like robots. If you spend any time with just about any animal, you can plainly see this is pure bullshit.
Yet, even he agreed that we shouldn't be mean to them. (Why, if they're just robots??) (This might tie into Kant's philosophy..simply pretend i wrote this further down. =)
Even by Kant's arguement (the way you described it) we'd be able to treat people who didn't display a certain amount of 'personhood' with less-than-human treatment. Say, do science experiments on them.
We should extend our compassion and respect because we CAN, not because a dog or cow is somehow more deserving or not.
I don't believe i contradict my own argument. I wouldn't argue that our physiology should dictate our behavior. If that were the case, the strongest folks should be able to do what they want, and us weaker ones do what they say. Real civilized. ;)
We're hardly built to be predators. So what if we have eyes on the front of our head? Silverback gorillas have eyes on the front of their head, they eat only plants. Humans are very fast, agile or strong. We have the delicate fingers, more suited to picking fruit (and eating insects, i'd argue) than tearing the flesh from a downed cow.
That concludes the previous page..onto this page!
 Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer! |
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 14:02:10
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Replies on this page..
Mel - how do you think things start to change? Does all of society wake up one day and decide 'oh..sexism is wrong, women should be able to work and vote too.'
It's started by a few people, and grows and builds.
So yeah, you not buying meat isn't going to take down the entire industry, but you do make a difference. Perhaps there won't be any animals killed today. Maybe not tomorrow. But in a year, the number will drop by whatever you were consuming. And it will remain that way as long as you are not buying it.
To say that you can't make a difference is really saying you don't want to change yourself, imo.
newo - i'm not sure what your point is...? If one chooses to look at everything as 'just energy', what's the point of doing anything?
Sure, on the absolute microcosm, we're all just energy..but it's pretty clear that there's more than this going on when you open your eyes and look around. Although interesting, i find this to be a poor base for any morals, behaviours or personal decisions.
Mel - you've gotta be kidding me with the four food groups! That's an entirely human construct, almost completely funded by the meat and dairy boards! 50 years ago there were like 12 food groups.
Sure, being veggie can be unhealthy. If all you eat is soda and chips. But that's not because you're veggie - it's because you're eating CRAP.
Bad diets make people unhealthy, not eating plant-based foods.
And besides, look at the amount of obesity out there - think that's mostly people ODing on broccoli and collards?? No - they're eating shitty food, and a lot of it is high-fat meat and dairy. (And a lot of processed carbs, which is another topic i don't want to cover here.)
There are a *lot* more helpful nutrients, in much more healthy forms from the plant kingdom than from flesh foods.
After all, where does all the 'good stuff' in meat come from? Plants.
k everyone...please don't all talk at once...heh..
Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer! |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 14:27:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Noisy
This all really a convenient smokescreen, imo. If you could really rate the death of a pig and a potato the same, you would also have to rate the same for a human and potato, to be logically consistant.
Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer!
What about Mr Potatohead???
Hansel and Gretel have formed a band, .....And You Will Know Us By The Trail Of Breadcrumbs!!! |
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El Barto
= Song DB Master =
USA
4020 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 14:29:16
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I think there's a HUGE difference between slavery, women's rights, sexism, and eating animals. You're comparing society's nature to human nature. Sure, my fingers might be nible enough to pick fruit, but my fists and arms are also strong enough to punch a chicken and eat it. Let me ask you this, do you believe in having pets?
Boycott cults |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 14:31:46
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quote:
Originally posted by realmeanmotorscutor
Why do some vegetarians still eat fish?
 "I joined the Cult of Popeye / The CoF required my good eye"
"I'ts OK to eat fish, 'cos they don't have any feelings"
Just like Kurt, I have never understood people who call themselves veggies but still do this. They give veggies a bad name. I respect vegans, but not veggies.
Hansel and Gretel have formed a band, .....And You Will Know Us By The Trail Of Breadcrumbs!!! |
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bumblebeeboy2
> Teenager of the Year <
United Kingdom
2638 Posts |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 14:48:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Noisy
[br
Silverback gorillas have eyes on the front of their head, they eat only plants.
Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer!
My friend saw one in in central Park zoo the other week and he was munching a huge green pepper apparently. I don't know why but I found this hilarious. Assuming he wasn't bred in captivity, he must wonder what the hell he is eating. They don't have green peppers in the jungle that they live in in the wild. Unless Tesco have a store there too now.
When he finished he walked over to the wall and lent on it like he trying to pick a girl up in a bar. I just makes me sad that he couldn't be doing that in the jungle. I don't mean it's sad that they don't have walls in jungles........oh you know what I mean.
Hansel and Gretel have formed a band, .....And You Will Know Us By The Trail Of Breadcrumbs!!! |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 14:50:55
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quote:
Originally posted by bumblebeeboy2
quote:
Originally posted by Homers_pet_monkey
"I'ts OK to eat fish, 'cos they don't have any feelings"
Just like Kurt, I have never understood people who call themselves veggies but still do this. They give veggies a bad name. I respect vegans, but not veggies.
Hansel and Gretel have formed a band, .....And You Will Know Us By The Trail Of Breadcrumbs!!!
so veggies who don't eat fish *or* meat? you don't respect them? why?
Vote Cult of Bumble and you may be allowed to join http://www.manchesteronline.co.uk/entertainment/busted/image.html?size=medium&busted_id=1602956&photo=RCK00079.JPG&startrow=73&maxrows=9
No veggies who eat fish but not meat. I don't get it. How can they choose to eat some animals but not others, unless it's on taste grounds only and not moral ones.
Hansel and Gretel have formed a band, .....And You Will Know Us By The Trail Of Breadcrumbs!!! |
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VoVat
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
9168 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 15:17:16
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quote:
Preaching is what I cant stand, you live your life, and let other live theirs.
Indeed, I think this is a good point. Yes, some religions and philosophical systems say it's wrong to eat meat. And some religions and philosophies systems that say it's wrong to have sex, drink wine, gamble, use electricity, etc. It's fine that they believe this, but trying to convert unwilling people to their own beliefs just doesn't make any sense. It's the same basic argument I have against busybody Christians wanting to outlaw gay marriage; it's trying to force other people to live by your standards, whether or not they agree with them.
On the other hand, if someone truly believes meat is murder, then I think it's somewhat more difficult to have a live-and-let-live attitude than with those other things. You're (generally) not hurting anyone by having gay sex or playing roulette (unless it's Russian roulette <g>), but if I had a religion where I said it was my moral responsibility to go out and kill five pregnant women every day, would you say, "Oh, well, to each his own"? I eat meat, and I don't think it's murder (animals eat each other all the time, after all), but I can kind of see how this might be a subject that certain people find hard NOT to preach about. (That aside, though, I wish they wouldn't.)
As for fish, no, someone who eats fish sure as hell isn't a vegetarian. It doesn't mean I don't have respect for them, though; fish are apparently better for you than a lot of kinds of meat, and some people are vegetarians for health reasons, rather than animals rights ones.
And speaking of Mr. Potato Head, remember when he was advertising fries at Burger King? He was advocating that people eat members of his own species! Shame on him!
I've reached 1000 posts / So I'm too cool to be in a cult. |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 15:36:13
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Yeah Vovat, that's what I said, it's OK if they are doing it on health or taste grounds. But not moral grounds. Then it doesn't make sense to eat fish but not other animals.
Hansel and Gretel have formed a band, .....And You Will Know Us By The Trail Of Breadcrumbs!!! |
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Apesy
= Cult of Ray =
USA
411 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 16:26:29
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quote:
Originally posted by El Barto
Sure, my fingers might be nible enough to pick fruit, but my fists and arms are also strong enough to punch a chicken and eat it.
Sure, you can kill a chicken with your bare hands easily enough, but do you really ever get this urge? When you're out walking in the forest, do you feel like tackling and devouring animals? Modern-day, "civilized" humans, who being so far removed from nature don't really have a primal, predatory instinct, and those that do usually unleash them on their fellow humans as well as defenseless animals...
-=Apesy |
Edited by - Apesy on 04/18/2004 17:06:47 |
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El Barto
= Song DB Master =
USA
4020 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 18:24:57
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No, I don't. We don't have to hunt our own food. Like I said, the process has evolved. That doesn't mean we shouldn't be eating meat. We still kill eachother. Animals still kill eachother.
Boycott cults |
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IceCream
= Quote Accumulator =
USA
1850 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2004 : 21:25:23
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quote:
We should extend our compassion and respect because we CAN, not because a dog or cow is somehow more deserving or not.
http://lynx.uio.no/catfolk/cnissues/cn11-05.htm
Dave, after reading the above article, may I ask:
Do you have 'compassion' and 'respect' for a tiger (of many tigers - the article does say "although leopards manage sometimes to coexist with tigers they are not common where tiger density is high") who ruthlessly and unrighteously killed these innocent leapords? Did the tiger have the right to kill them?
Of course, one can argue that the tigers are carnivores. Now, here's a question - do tigers choose to be carnivores? Theoretically, could a tiger live on plants?
Fantastic topic, Carolyn. Really thought-provoking. |
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bedrock_barney
= Cult of Ray =
United Kingdom
871 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2004 : 03:14:17
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There are a few more vegans/vegetarians than I thought lurking on these boards:
Dave N - vegan
DeBased - 15 year vegetarian
billgoodman - vegetarian from birth
obfuscate - 4 year vegetarian
bumblybee - chicken tikka vegetarian
me - 20 year vegetarian
Any more want to 'come out' and declare their love for all things green and leafy?
I love being a vegetarian (apart from eating out at restaurants which sucks most of the time - you can only eat so many precooked lasagnes). My wife and kids are also vegetarians. I actually wonder what will happen when my children grow up. Will they be tempted to eat meat at some point? (to have a point of reference at the very least). Both of them are adamant that they will always be vegetarians but they are still to experience their teenage years so anything could happen!
The thing I find the most amusing is the discussions that take place when I find myself eating at, say, a business lunch. The days of vegetarians being seen as cranky are over but most meat eaters are genuinely puzzled that I can lead a healthy lifestyle sans meat. The question I am asked ad nauseum is 'But what do you eat'?? Barbeques are always fun as well. Meat eaters go into an all out flesh eating frenzy for some reason - plates piled high with part cooked animal components.....and a token baby tomato sat on a solitary lettuce leaf.
 "I've rejoined the Cult of Ming / Star of favourite childhood movie of 1980" |
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bumblebeeboy2
> Teenager of the Year <
United Kingdom
2638 Posts |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2004 : 08:50:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Noisy
Carolyn - do you know this for sure? If so, it really does make this campaign much more acceptable, i was assuming the picture was... I don't know either way..
Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer!
No, its just what I heard. |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6213 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2004 : 09:01:58
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he dave, you were absolutely right with your egg reply
but what's wrong with eating a free-range egg?
That's of course when you are 100% sure that the chicken was free when laying that egg.
 "I joined the Cult of Frank/Nobody wanted to join my Culf" |
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2004 : 11:20:30
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Jim - sure, there are differences. There are differences between sexism and racism. But there are probably more similarities. All are based on a desire of power, and usually created in ignorance. And none are truly justifiable.
As for punching a chicken - sure. But you can also punch a human. What's your point? Yeah, you *can*. Does that mean you *should*?
And i think the point Apsey was making is that we aren't 'wired' to be carnivores. Meat, in its 'natural' state is quite disgusting to most people. Especially organs. If you want to go with the 'nature' argument (which i generally don't) - any true carnivore or omnivore would *drool* at the sight of organ meat.
We don't. Nuff said.
IceCream - it's not as simple as 'mean tigers'. Their habitat has been deminished considerably, and there isn't room for the tigers and leopards to co-exist. Humans are to blame here.
To call it 'ruthless' is ridiculous. Do tigers feel or experience ruth? I don't know - do you? Does anybody?
All we can do is guess - and it's most likely they were defending their territory. The leopards don't have anywhere else to go, and were essentially 'backed into a corner' and chose to fight rather than flee. (I'm pretty sure a leopard could escape from a tiger.)
Again, it's human interference that's the root of the problem.
Tigers *could* live on a plant-based diet, but would doubtless need certain suppliments, most likely the amino acid taurine, which is rather low in plants. More info on how cats can eat veggie at www.vegancats.com
Bedrock! - there're a few more. There's one user with the handle 'vegan'. =)
Jop - i'll give *organic* eggs a sliver of credit, those chickens do live better lives than in factory farms. There are no standards or regulations in the US or Canada for 'free range', so it's little more than a lip-service.
It's still exploitation tho. And i find that objectionable. I don't think the chickens should be kept in cages, no matter how large. They're also still bred to produce unnatural amounts of eggs. It's all pretty fucked up, imo.
 www.frankblack.net/images/icon-flyingpig.gif" border="0"> Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer! |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6213 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2004 : 13:36:45
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ok dave, that's your opinion, and I respect that, in fact I think you have a good piont
"I joined the Cult of Frank/Nobody wanted to join my Culf" |
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El Barto
= Song DB Master =
USA
4020 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2004 : 15:33:53
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You missed my question: do you believe in having pets?
Boycott cults |
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slaveish
= Cult of Ray =
USA
269 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2004 : 18:15:20
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vegetarianism is good. good for the body, good for the environment, non-violent, inexpensive, forward-thinking.
there is an ad being run in the ny subway cars right now for a self-storage place. it has a photograph of a trophy moose head, with a bubble coming out of his mouth which reads "my owner is now a peta member."
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2004 : 21:27:02
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Thanks Jop. =)
Jim - wanted to stick to animals used for food for this topic.. But no, i don't believe in 'pets'. I'm a strong advocate of spaying and neutering, and find breeders to be quite repulsive.
And assholes who spend $2000 on a puppy while others are being killed down the street at the shelter...
I have no problems with people having companion animals per se, it's definitely the best option for these critters, but one day i hope that keeping other animals is no longer done.
Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer! |
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realmeanmotorscutor
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1764 Posts |
Posted - 04/19/2004 : 21:35:18
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I have an assload of cats and love them all dearly. I understand the moral dillema of keeping animals captive and there are some (ex. birds) that I will not keep. I justify owning cats by reminding myself that I'm truly lengthening their lives and keeping them happy and healthy. They really are happy and wouldn't be doing anything otherwise. I'm still mulling over my feelings on animal ownership but I know I'll never not have a cat.
I really want a bearded dragon but can't decide if that's right or not.
"I joined the Cult of Popeye / The CoF required my good eye" |
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DeBased
- FB Fan -
USA
118 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2004 : 00:48:23
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I can't believe the popularity of this thread. There is a lot being tossed around here. What can I say?
Making a difference: Vegetarianism is something you do on your own. You can live according to your own beliefs and it makes a difference. You do not have to join a religion or work for an advocacy group to do it. Consumer choices have a big impact on the marketplace - I can attest to how many veg/vegan grocery products are out there now as opposed to 15 years ago. Even in small towns. You have the restaurant and clothing choices now. The world changes, it does not remain the same. Has anyone seen a hybrid car? This is why some people still vote in the US. I love animals and I like to live in a way that reflects my own values when I can, and it has been convenient enough for me to live like this. I don't see changing it, but maybe doing more down the road when I'm not so busy with my family, etc.
Self-Righteousness: Vegetarianism is not about preaching. I RARELY discuss it with anyone. Meat eaters talk to me about meat and fishing and whatever else they're doing all the time. I don't feel threatened by it, it's the world where I live. It's suprising how many people get uptight when I "confess" my vegetarianism, though. I wonder if these people are offended when a person is of a different religion than they are. I am discussing it here because the topic was raised, and I wasn't going to sit back and watch Dave go it alone. I love vegans. BTW, vegetarians are not the minority in all countries, but we tend to think the rest of the world is just like here. This is the most I've discussed this in at least 10 years and its not why I joined the forum! I usually leave the arguing to the Meat and Dairy Councils and folks like PETA (there has to be SOMEONE on our side).
Putting People First: I do. I love people, I volunteer my time for a human non profit. I love my carnivorous husband and friends dearly. We live and let live together. Putting people first has zero to do with what I eat.
Health: Please remember that some people are vegan/vegetarian for health reasons and it has nothing to do with animal rights. 2 people I cook for in my family cannot have any dairy for two very different reasons. A lot of people with various health issues have to go vegetarian and that's what keeps them out of the hospital.
Lots of vegetarians are not into animal welfare but belong to one religion or another that has food guidelines.
the fish question: eating fish does not fall under being vegetarian.
animals other than humans don't think, feel or love: the only explanation of this is that there is a serious lack of education sometimes
animals eating animals argument: most of the animals people eat in the west are nonviolent, vegetarian animals
Other than that, I do not agree with an all or nothing kind of mentality towards these issues. Every bit helps. Small, humane farming is better. Buying antibiotic free/or organic/or free range meat is better and it helps more than just animals. Just like if you recycle 1/2 the time it is better than never. I appreciate things meat-eaters do that make a little difference, like choosing a different brand of tunafish or whatever.
And blah blah blah.
Sometimes doesn't the push to conform to the norm just drag on you?
the method...of stop tap spin, no talkin'... |
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DeBased
- FB Fan -
USA
118 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2004 : 01:04:52
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Did you see the annoyingly long post above? Here's a couple fun things for you. My husband (who wears a leather jacket and has a car with leather interior) is jealous of my way cool vinyl guitar straps I got from www.buyolympia.com/queenbee (cool purses and stuff too you can put an lp or a 45 in)
Vegetarians here will love this flick: www.themeatrix.com
The rest of you can see what you think.
I love ya all. Big kiss to El Barto! You sound just like my husband! I understand where you're coming from, believe me.
the method...of stop tap spin, no talkin'... |
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2004 : 10:23:24
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Yeah, i love my guitar straps too, i went with DiMarzio click-lock straps, very nice, and very convenient. And they will never come off..sweet.
Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer! |
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DeBased
- FB Fan -
USA
118 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2004 : 11:30:15
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those DiMarzio straps look really cool, and a good value at $20
the method...of stop tap spin, no talkin'... |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2004 : 04:01:15
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Dave, I said with regards to your statement about a tomato not being alive in any way that the fundamental similarity of all matter would indicate a tomato is just as alive as we are.
Cheers,
Owen
--
"You one of those right-wing nut outfits?" inquired the diplomatic Metzger.
Fallopian twinkled. "They accuse us of being paranoids."
"They?" inquired Metzger, twinkling also.
"Us?" asked Oedipa.
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PETA Billboards
