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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
 Posted - 04/26/2004 : 12:46:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Carolynanna
Just because you're from the UK doesn't mean you can push your preoccupation with sheep on me! ;)
and Owen, bovine characteristics?
Please, please...can't we just get along, and not let our nationality differences get in the way? This is how wars start.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 12:56:20
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In slaughterhouses when they truck in the livestock they're all too spooked from the transit for any one of them to make the first move into the the killing floor gate, so an animal is kept there permanantly called the Judas Cow who has been trained to trot through the gate, and once it moves, the rest move no problem. So I mean docility, a tendency for an individual to do something because someone else does and not cause the individual wants it.
-Owen |
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klikger
= Cult of Ray =
693 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:02:46
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| Humanism is a religion too with man viewing himself as God. We are all sheep of some sort in most aspects of life. |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:03:47
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Very apt illustration.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:09:57
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The theme of followers of God being likened to sheep runs throughout the entire Bible.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:19:31
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quote:
The Calistanian Posted - 04/26/2004 : 12:28:47
Bible reading and research is encouraged, to make sure you believe what is being taught
Seeing as the Jesus story incorporates elements from those of deities predating Christianity such as Adad of Assyria, Adonis, Apollo, Heracles ("Hercules") and Zeus of Greece, Alcides of Thebes, Attis of Phrygia, Baal of Phoenicia, Bali of Afghanistan, Beddru of Japan, Buddha, Crite of Chaldea, Deva Tat of Siam, Hesus of the Druids, Horus, Osiris, and Serapis of Egypt (whose long-haired, bearded appearance was adopted for the Christ character), Indra of Tibet/India, Jao of Nepal, Krishna of India, Mikado of the Sintoos, Mithra, Sungod of Persia, Odin of the Scandinavians, Prometheus of Caucasus/Greece, Quetzalcoatl of Mexico, Salivahana of Bermuda, Tammuz of Syria (later turned into the disciple Thomas), Thor of the Gauls, Universal Monarch of the Sibyls, Wittoba of the Bilingonese, Xamolxis of Thrace, Zarathustra/Zoroaster of Persia, Zoar of the Bonzes, it's patently obvious that all the "holy" books are just variations on a theme, so why stop with just the Bible?
-Owen |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:25:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Newo
So I mean docility, a tendency for an individual to do something because someone else does and not cause the individual wants it.
-Owen
Yes that happens all the time,
but because we eat cattle? |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:36:34
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Good point, but since God ("YHWH", "Yaveh", or "Jehovah") makes plain the fact in the Hebrew Scriptures (or Old Testament, which predates these other deities you bring up) that "there are no other God's besides me", there is no need to look at them (actually there is a need to look at them, merely to see they are contrived from the Hebrew God), as they are all based on Him. Since the Hebrew Scriptures were authored by God, with full knowledge of sending His son Jesus in the future based on Messianic prophecies, these holy books rightfully make up the Bible canon, and therefore precede the qualities of the deities you bring up.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
Edited by - The Calistanian on 04/26/2004 13:38:48 |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:42:06
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Plus the fact that the complete Bible has been preserved throughout the long history of mankind, even in the face of attempts to eliminate it, shows the Bible has a special attribute. Whereas, these other "stories" are just a fragmented shell of what they originally were.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
Edited by - The Calistanian on 04/26/2004 13:43:09 |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:56:08
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quote:
Carolynanna Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:25:50
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes that happens all the time,
but because we eat cattle?
We've spent millennia eating and absorbing into every fibre of our bodies every fibre of theirs, right down to those yummy amino acids that make up their DNA.
-Owen |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 14:03:30
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I think the point of all this is:
Don't be a mindless follower of any religion. And do your best to fight of all of your cattle tendencies.<smiley face>
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 14:21:21
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There were different names used for what is now translated as Lord God, in the first part of Genesis it was actually 'Elohim', and after Chapter 2 Verse 3 'Jehovah Elohim'. Both have plural endings, hence 'gods'. So who were these fellows they were talking about?
-Owen |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 14:32:26
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It is well known that the pre-human Jesus was God's first creation. Everything after was made with the help of Jesus. I don't have a Bible in front of me right now, but somewhere around chapter 2, God is quoted as saying: "Let us make man in our image". Who is he talking to? Pre-human Jesus. In John chapter 1 verse 1, it speaks of "the Word", or the pre-human Jesus. In most Bibles it reads "The Word is God". If you go back to the original translation, it should read "The Word is a god". How can Jesus be a god if there is only one God? Because there are many terms for the word "god" in the original translation. However, the English language being as cruddy as it is, isn't that versatile. I believe the derivation of "god" being used for Jesus is "a powerful one". So, still only one God in the almighty sense.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 14:39:01
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Well, Owen, I have to go for the day, so maybe we can continue this another time. I just didn't want you to think I was wimping out on you or anything.<smiley face>
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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Cheeseman1000
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Iceland
8201 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 15:15:44
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'Elohim' means God plural, and refers to Father, Son and Holy Spirit. However, its implication is still singular, if I remember right. I don't really understand it.
 "I joined the Cult Of Joey and Iggy/Cos they can hypnotise chickens" |
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undone_20
- FB Fan -
Canada
27 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 19:44:37
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This is kind of off topic, but it is on the topic of christianity
if Satan punishes all the bad souls in the world, wouldn't that make him good?
Rock on! |
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ProverbialCereal
- FB TabMaster -
USA
2953 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 22:33:23
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Well, as far as Christianity is concerned, Satan isn't the one doing the punishing. God is the one who punishes souls. I guess Satan would be the dude who just tries to lead people astray. As in... we, like SHEEP, go astray.
Join the Cult of ... to be continued |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 06:31:42
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And if you look further into the Bible, there is no soul after death. When we're alive, we are a living soul. Souls are not tortured after death by Satan, let alone God. Like ProverbialCereal says, humans are led astray by Satan. So, the wickedness in the world is Satan's doing...God just allows it for now to prove humans have no way to ever rule themselves sufficiently. According to my in-depth Bible research.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 08:45:42
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Off but on topic,
what does the catholic church say about suicide now? anyone know? |
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madtempest
- FB Fan -
USA
225 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 08:50:37
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| They say, it's good for you! ;) |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 08:56:02
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Well, I don't know about the Catholic church, but a loving God would view a person who commits suicide in a loving way. Someone who is driven to suicide must be so mentally disturbed it has to be viewed as if they have a terminal disease, like cancer or something, something out of their control. It shouldn't be viewed as harsh as "self-murder". A few months ago, I had a good friend that committed suicide, and the things he brought up in his note couldn't possibly have driven someone in their right mind to suicide. Therefore, since I know the feelings of sorrow I had when he died, I would hope a loving God had the same feelings.
Sorry, that was a little off topic on your question, Carolynanna.<smiley face>
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 08:56:19
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They allow suicides to be buried on 'consecrated' ground now so I'd assume the attitude has relaxed in some measure, tho spose they'd have to in my country as it is a party trick in some regions.
-Owen |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 09:07:40
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Why and how can they change their views on that?
Does anyone know what it exactly says in the bible on that topic? |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 09:34:45
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The Bible says in Psalms (sorry, I don't have a Bible in front of me to tell you exactly where): "God is comforting the depressed souls". Based on that principle, someone who commits suicide out of depression would not be looked down upon by a loving God. The term soul here refers to an alive person.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 09:41:04
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The only instance of someone committing suicide in the Bible, that I can think of offhand, was Judas Iscariot. As Jesus' traitor, I doubt he gets much lienency from God on that one, as it could be an "unforgivable" sin. So, probably the circumstances have to be taken into consideration, like the person's state of mind before committing suicide, or his actions previous to. These are things only God could judge.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 10:22:57
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They change their views to suit whichever direction the wind blows. And as for the Bible (or any of the holy books), it's just an ancient pagan religion given new window dressing to hide the mass of esoteric symbolism (i.e. Jesus Christ the Sun)which is readily available to the initiates of the mystery schools.
"It has served us well, this myth of Christ"
- Pope Leo X
-Owen |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 10:25:41
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| Interesting, go on... |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 10:50:38
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I mentioned a list above of figures predating Christ with the same life-story attributed. Many of these have their traditional birthdays on December 25th, on account of the ancients having noticed that the sun makes an annual descent southward until December 21-22 (winter solstice), then it stops moving southerly for 3 days and starts to go north again. When this happened, the ancients declared that the sun had 'died' for 3 days and was 'born again' on the 25th. It followed that cultures all over the world celebrated the 'sun of God's' birth on December 25th. Too, in some areas the calendar originally began in the constellation of Virgo, which is where we get the sun being 'born of a Virgin'. At 12 noon the sun is in the house or temple of the 'Most High' - 'he' begins 'his Father's work' at 'age' 12. The sun enters into each sign of the zodiac at 30°, thus the 'Sun of God' begins his ministry at 'age' 30. The sun is hung on a cross or 'crucified,' which represents its passing through the equinoxes, the vernal equinox being Easter, at which time it is then resurrected.
-Owen |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 11:00:25
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The Bible does not say anything about when Christ was born. The holiday Christmas is, like Owen said, based on the date of the sun god's birth. The Bible does not support birthdays. When Jesus was born, there were still shepherds outside with their sheep, which would not have happened in December in the Palestinian area. So, it is believed Christ was born around October. So, yes, according to other religions, like Catholicism, there accounts of Jesus resemble many stories that predated it, mainly with Greek and Roman influence. But the fact remains, Jesus himself could not have been born on December 25th according to circumstances. The account of Jesus then becomes original. There are many other items pertaining to Christ that the Bible does not teach, yet Catholics teach. For instance, Christ did not die on a cross.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 11:16:26
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This time it's me has to go, I've gotta buy water before the shops shut. It was nice talking to you guys.
-Owen |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 11:23:57
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See ya!
I appreciate your knowledgeableness (is that a word?) on the subject!
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 11:32:20
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I just think it's important, if you're in a religion, to do research on what you're being taught...because it may not be what you think.
There's nothing worse than blind faith.
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 13:51:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Carolynanna
Just because you're from the UK doesn't mean you can push your preoccupation with sheep on me! ;)
and Owen, bovine characteristics?
I'm not Welsh!!!
Hansel and Gretel have formed a band, .....And You Will Know Us By The Trail Of Breadcrumbs!!! |
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Cheeseman1000
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Iceland
8201 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2004 : 15:15:41
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Hey Calistanian! You're aware its cheating to post lots of little posts... the true masters say lots in each post and still rack up unfeasibly high counts: cf. Dean...
"I joined the Cult Of Joey and Iggy/Cos they can hypnotise chickens" |
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The Calistanian
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1342 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2004 : 06:41:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Cheeseman1000
Hey Calistanian! You're aware its cheating to post lots of little posts... the true masters say lots in each post and still rack up unfeasibly high counts: cf. Dean...
"I joined the Cult Of Joey and Iggy/Cos they can hypnotise chickens"
What can I say...I'm a fake!
You should know about that Cheeseman1000! Or are you scared...
I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
Edited by - The Calistanian on 04/28/2004 06:44:28 |
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