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Originally posted by vilainde

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Originally posted by lucmove
I always thought that Bossanova was trying to be commercial

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Not muc time to read everything, but I read THIS. Are you kidding me? Have you ever seen the Velouria vid?

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Originally posted by lucmove
Try telling that to my loins.

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Originally posted by lucmove

I have a hundred things to say on this topic, so congratulations if you have the patience to read it all. Hey, I read all the posts in the thread!

First off, lots of uninformed opinion flung around about Sonic Youth. It's one hell of a solid, history-making band. They deserve their legendary status. The NYC-Ghosts&Flowers album is good, though certainly not their finest. Pitchfork was unfair with their review, but not completely inaccurate. The album was largely criticized by the critic, especially because of the lyrics, which are lame indeed. That's more or less the same I think about the Pitchfork review of EP1, the score was too harsh, but the argumentation was very valid. EP1 is a major disappointment, only rabid fanbois refuse to see it. Dissing Kim Gordon is foolish. She is sexy and does her job pretty well with the bass. Why should there be any loftier expectations around her? What is wrong with being just good? She is not even the frontman. And she screams only occasionally with the Sonic Youth. I know, I am a fan. Kim Shattuck, in comparison, does nothing but scream. Well, at least so it seems from the two Muffs albums I downloaded recently. Anyway, these two Kims should not have been compared, because they're too different.

I have nothing to say on this alleged EP2, since it's not even released yet. Apparently, neither have you lot. Look at how this thread went quickly from "EP2" to "hey let's all talk about Charles Thompson's awesome body of work as a whole." Makes sense, since EP2 doesn't even exist yet. But I also think it's telling that talking about Charles Thompson's awesome body of work as a whole still generates a lot more numerous, passionate and detailed posts than the pitiful EP1 will ever generate. I can add mine, but with less passion.

I love everything that Stevio10 wrote about the Catholics era, but I have a quite different view of Charles' trajectory. It's a little bit grim, so brace yourselves.

I tend to view Charles and His Monikers as an artist that craves attention and recognition and works really hard for it, and has gotten an endless dose of frustration in return.

It all begins with the Pixies. It's awesome, public and critics love it, but Kim Deal suddenly becomes a big deal, steals the spotlight and everybody now knows that Black Francis hated that. He soon got to hate the woman, mostly for having her own charisma. So he pulls the plug on the Pixies with a fax. Meow.

Then he wants to put the Pixies well past him. He changes his moniker to Frank Black to make it very clear that the Pixies era is finished, and also makes it very clear who wore the pants in the Pixies by releasing two albums that blow all ships, cruisers and carriers out of the water. Two albums that got... very little attention. Nearly none in comparison with all the hoopla the Pixies had been growing used to. Frank Black thinks... what the hell???

Enter the Catholics era. I have mixed (and possibly very uninformed) feelings about that era. On the one hand, it's always seemed to me that he was kind of broke around that time and didn't want to spend a lot of money with overly produced albums anymore, especially if they're not going to get the attention and recognition they deserve. What about touring that kind of material? He would need an orchestra to replicate the sound. He would probably not even have enough attendance to pay for the extravagance. Besides, the muthafucka really set the bar impossibly high and would soon find himself in serious trouble for not being able to outdo or even keep up with himself. I suspect he felt he was painting himself into a corner with that and decided to take a sharp U turn: two track, count to three and rock'n'roll. Cheap, sustainable and effective. That's my view of the Catholics era: it was sustainable. Sure, the man summoned a pretty impressive line-up, he's never been one to be sloppy, but that arrangement was probably almost as cheap as respectable.

Another thing about the Catholics era was glaring to me: although it was awesome rough rock'n'roll, I remember I was particularly stricken by how formulaic it often was. Examples: Six-sixty-six, Solid Gold, Steak'n'Sabre, The Man Who Was Too Loud, King and Queen of Siam, Billy Radcliffe, Constant Sorrow Man, Pan American Highway, Le Cigar Volant, Whiskey in Your Shoes, and numerous references to dogs. Just look at those titles. They all sound contrived. I can see a man wearing a trenchcoat, dark glasses and a badass frown trying hard to be seen as a very, very serious dark and mysterious man who tells stories, nay, legends of the wild west carefully crafted to send chills down spines, make jaws drop, and strike awe and... aw sorry, I mean the whole thing sounds foolish under a certain light. If it's any consolation, this comes from a guy who loathes Tarantino because he spends way, way too much time shooting extreme violence and moronic dialogues in an endless effort to seem badass.

Let me explain one thing I always loved about the Pixies besides their music: their pictures. More specifically, their smiles and natural attitude before a camera. Especially Kim. Oh, that smile on Kim... She smiled like an amateur. An awesome amateur. What the fuck? It's just a picture. Let's do what any normal person does when taking a picture: let's smile for posterity. Meanwhile, countless bands went miles out of their way just to seem badass in their pictures. Or weird. Or intellectual. Or any other warm, steaming pile of bovine feces. Not the Pixies. They didn't need that shit. They would just smile like kids on vacation, then walk into stage and deliver such a punch that made Metallica or Iron Maiden sound like pussies. Francis all humble in his flannels but RAGING on the microphone and Kim aways smiling, occasionally saying " - Thanks!" They were frighteningly powerful and frighteningly natural. Gosh, that was humiliating to a lot of people. The Pixies were the perfect response to all the clowns that wear leather pants, hair extensions and make devil signals with their hands. The Pixies outed their travesty without a single speck of mercy, the exact amount they deserved. I have no idea if any of that was ever intentional or at least aware. I don't care. Who does? Justice was served.

Every moron who even utters "Loud Quiet Loud" should get a hard slap upside the head. Loud-quiet-loud never had anything to do with anything. The Pixies were awesome because they were unpredictable in a shockingly natural way. Trying to peg the Pixies was like trying to swat a fly in a house infested with slow, crawling roaches.

So it took me a while to stomach the Catholics era. Most of it didn't seem natural to me anymore. It seemed that Frank was trying too hard to impress. I don't like that, as you can see. Anyway, the central part of this rambling is that I see the Catholics era with a slightly desperate Charles Thompson trying to impress, especially while or after The Breeders' "Last Splash" got so much attention. He even hung up the phone on a journalist who asked him about Kim Deal's successful ventures. He was sour. He was doing a great job, and it was not properly recognized. It is understandable. Meanwhile, mediocre bands were getting lots of attention: The Strokes, Coldplay, Greenday, Blink 182, even the fucking New Radicals were getting more exposure than Frank Black. What the fuck is wrong with the world?

Well, Mr. Thompson certainly delivered a large amount of impressive work with the Catholics, especially with Black Letter Days and Devil's Workshop, nicely chronicled in one single post by fellow forum member Stevio10. But there is yet another glitch in my very particular view.

I consider Black Letter Days and Devil's Workshop another grab for attention: TWO albums released simultaneously. I am not complaining, I loved it, I love the two records, but it totally seems to me that Charles was showing off: look at me, releasing two albums, I am that prolific and awesome, that should get some attention from the press, who else can pull something like that off... Did it work? It should have, but it doesn't seem like it. I saw few mentions of it anywhere. I remember how lonely I felt. Again. Nobody cares about my hero. The world sucks.

I already thought that Frank Black was being formulaic with the Catholics and their songs about would-be legends of the far west. But I got a quite uncomfortable feeling when I saw pictures of FB & C all dressed in cowboy outfits. That really seemed like a money grab to me. You know, cowboy music is kind of a sure shot because it's such a faithful crowd. They just work hard during the day then go to the bar at night and love their sweet, country music. Good, money-earning-and-spending patrons. Also, not a very demanding audience, very different from the pretentious, impossible-standards artsy alt rock brat crowd that accepts nothing but a constant stream of groundbreaking shit with every record and... doesn't work much and is always broke and has no money to spend and complains that comeback EPs are overpriced. Let's face it: it makes sense from a business perspective. The rock'n'roll audience is tough and ungrateful unless you play for the dumb heavy metal crowds.

Soooo, when Frank Black went into his so-called Nashville period, I couldn't avoid thinking, Holy shit, the man has totally switched crowds. This guy knows what he is doing. He gave up on shitty, thankless rock'n'roll, has become a country musician. Sigh... He will be missed, but whatever he wants to do with his life is his business, I guess. Sobs...

In the larger picture, what I mean is that Charles was once again going where he thought he was going to get more recognition and reward. Call it "commercial" if you will, I've been avoiding that word all along my post, but you don't have to if you don't want. Just don't lose sight of it: my point is that he is, in reality, constantly looking for very explicit recognition. He has been sick of being "alternatiive" for a very long time.

Don't worry, my post is just about to get worse.

I don't mean this has been just about fortune and glory. Clearly, the man has issues with his ego. For starters, he hated Kim Deal for stealing a little bit of his stardom. Joey confirms that theory in that documentary we all know. That just doesn't make sense to me. If I had a band, I would love to have a Kim Deal bringing audience to the gigs. People knew he was the songwriter, and she was just a nice sight and a sweet voice, nothing wrong with that, but he couldn't stand it. Then the same documentary shows the man talking on the phone and complaining that nobody cares about his solo work, just his Pixies era so he has to reform the band, then he goes to bed with headphones on and some kind of Stuart Little self-confidence building mantra... Everybody has issues, and he has his share. Fine. But that reveals something about him that I sometimes perceive as a flaw: insecurity and a need to impress. That doesn't jive with the monster that plastered the world against the wall while he was fronting the Pixies. Sometimes I even think he doesn't realize who he is and what he represents. More likely he does, but doesn't care for/about it.

Which brings me to the next part: after Catholics.

Who is he, and what does he represent? I have come to believe, regrettably, that the real significance of Frank Black Francis is widely but almost secretly known, and will never be duly recognized until he is dead, cold and stiff. When he passes, you can bet your ass the the story-hungry press will sing every single possible kind of praise to him, and an army of artists will pay tribute to him, and the public at large, this dumb mass that can't tell Steve Winwood from Justin Bieber and needs to be told what to like will just think,

What, this guy was that awesome? Really??? How come I never heard of him? Gee.. Well, I guess then I am going to buy and listen to his shit.

Because baby, that's art. That's how a lot of this shit business works.

And I guess post-Catholics Charles Michael Kittridge Thompson the Fourth (no less) realizes that, has gone through therapy, and gracefully given up on becoming a widely recognized living legend, and lends himself to much more personal and unpretentious songwriting. After the Catholics, I see a much more free Charles or whatever he calls himself dabbling here and there, back to rock'n'roll where his REAL audience is (what the hell were you thinking???) and not giving much more than half a fuck and doing pretty great sometimes, not so great at others, because this is the second decade of the Internet-based, proudly jaded 21st century and you're a fool if you give a full, whole fuck about anything anymore. He will just spend some time with his kids and crank out some tunes now and then. He doesn't seem to be pretentious anymore.


But wait! Suddenly the Pixies are back! Why??? What does he want with that? Ooooh! Suspended breath. What is going to happen now...?

Aw, geez. Another Toe in the Ocean??? The guy wants to be popular again???

Go home, Charles. You're drunk.

(fwiw)

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"- Thanks!"

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Originally posted by Discoking

don't you think they will compile the different eps into one album and then give the album a normal release?

it doesn't make sense to me to limit a new pixies release to 5,000 copies. there must be way more interest than that.
if pixies came out with a new full album today, surely they'd sell a lot more than 5,000 copies, no? or is everything these days in downloads anyway, and are 5,000 physical copies close to what they would have sold, even if it wasn't a limited release? i think not, but i may be wrong.

i even wonder if they can earn back what was invested in recording the album/collection of new songs, by selling it the way they're selling it now.
i guess dividing the whole thing into different eps means they can ask more money for the same batch of songs: you'll pay more for four or five eps than you will for an album. but limited to 5,000 copies? dunno. is that enough?

i assume this is just the first round. the indie round: collecting money from the people who are into vinyl, and/or collect, or don't want to wait to hear the new songs. once this round is over, they'll do another, more commercial round that aims at the rest of the market, for example by releasing the new songs as an album, the normal way (cd, itunes, ...)

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it's educational

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Originally posted by lucmove

4) Before he goes to sleep, he puts on a pair of headphones and repeats some self confidence building mantra (last time I said Stuart Little, but I meant Stuart Smalley; google it). How can someone write such brilliant music and lyrics and even NEED that kind of self-help stuff? It seems he feels that people don't like him enough, or he doesn't like himself enough.
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"- Thanks!"

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Originally posted by TRANSMARINE

Looking forward to hearing the final version of Tranquilize Me...the Blue Eyed Hexe we've been given at their concerts is a complete 180 of the demo recording.

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"I want the guy who did this. I want him. I want him bad........" TJ Hooker
-bRIAN

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Originally posted by BunsenH

This is just too long to wait.

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Originally posted by IBreed

first of all, can you qualify these two statements (and please don't post a link to twitter) "in keeping with the current generation's preference for bite-sized info and culture" and "smaller/shorter collections of new material seem to be on the ascent."

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Originally posted by IBreed
secondly, of course a rock band out selling a pop act is an exception.

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Originally posted by IBreed
but my point ultimately isn't that the rock LP is still raking in the big bucks, it's that, in the right hands and with the right intentions, it's still a viable format and people WILL pay for an ALBUM if they feel it's worth it. a band like the arcade fire shares a similar stature to the pixies. had the pixies put together an album worth hearing in its entirety instead of subscribing the the pop mentality (and the pixies will never be a pop band with massive pop appeal), they too could have made that kind of impact.

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Originally posted by Kogi

In a interview with a danish music magazine, BF is pretty direct about future releases: 'EP2' is on the way, and they're looking at offers from labels to release an album (though not from 4AD, for some reason that he's not aware of himself).
A very short and informative interview in danish: http://gaffa.dk/nyhed/77806

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Originally posted by windupbird

Oh Ok, thanks.. Actually, "Whimsical noise rock" is pretty accurate, when you think about it. I do like the word "Kradsborstig", though.

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Originally posted by pedrothelion

Hello,

When EP2 will be available?
It's possible to pre order it?

Ciao
Riccardo

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Originally posted by pedrothelion

Thank you!

Where should I register to receive these news?
Unfortunately I could not buy the EP1!

Ciao
Riccardo

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