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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
 Posted - 12/30/2006 : 05:45:01
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Is there really much to say about this? Good riddance, I guess.
 Is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho? |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 06:19:04
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I am not sure it's the right thing to do. I can't fully make up my mind. But yeah, he certainly won't be missed by me.
 I'd walk her everyday, into a shady place
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starmekitten
-= Forum Pistolera =-
United Kingdom
6370 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 08:24:10
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I don't like it a bit.
Idiot. |
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ScottP
= Cult of Ray =
USA
618 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 10:51:14
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| I wonder if he crapped? |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 11:00:29
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I guess we'll see the reactions in Iraq. What a mess that is.
I'm sure there will be a price to pay. Timing could've been better.
As for Saddam, I couldn't care less about the well-being of someone with so much blood on their hands. I suppose in that context there should be alot of people hanging from the gallows. Although he got what he deserved, he certainly is a huge scapegoat.
But if death penalties exist, that's the way to do it. No sitting around jail cells for 20 years appealing decisions.
__________
For Chrissakes have a cup of tea. |
Edited by - Carolynanna on 12/30/2006 12:06:21 |
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s_wrenn
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1851 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 11:02:32
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What will happen in south park now?
He was dead, in hell, then in heaven making wmd's, then alive in canada. Will they re-kill him off?
I deeply disappointed in Bush. He should have taken up hussein's challenge for a duel.
"I am the prime minister of Canada. What do you giys want?"
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Daisy Girl
~ Abstract Brain ~
Belize
5305 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 11:06:54
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| LOL S Wrenn. I guess the good part about S. H. being in hell is that you have to be dead there and they can keep the character? Seriously, though, I am anti death penality so I wish they wouldn't have executed him. |
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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 11:31:01
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I'm anti-death penalty, too, but I can't seem to feel too bad about this one. I even spent part of the morning looking for video clips of the hanging. (Never did find one.) What's weird, though, is that it came about so quickly. His trial was really drawn out, and nearly became a circus. Then suddenly it was announced he'd be executed soon, and everyone thought there would be endless appeals, and then, snap, he's dead.
When the U.S. killed Timothy McVeigh, it really bothered me. I grew up in Wyoming, and now live in Colorado, but neither of those states has killed anyone while I've been in them -- so I didn't have the blood of anyone on my hands. But I *am* -- as a U.S. citizen -- partly responsible for killing McVeigh. That's always felt like a small mark against my soul. So, in that sense, I'm glad Iraq killed Hussein, rather than the U.S. doing it.
Is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho? |
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kathryn
~ Selkie Bride ~
Belgium
15320 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 11:34:24
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Coastline, "Iraq" didn't kill him. It was very much the U.S. who killed him.
Meanwhile, back in 83
I got some heaven in my head
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Frog in the Sand
-+ Le premiere frog +-
France
2715 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 11:50:26
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Back in 1975...
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BLACKOLERO le only Frank Black / Pixies site 100% in français |
Edited by - Frog in the Sand on 12/30/2006 11:51:13 |
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Carl
- A 'Fifth' Catholic -
Ireland
11546 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 11:50:54
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That photo is just sickening! It just totally sums up political hypocrisy.
 Merry Christmas! |
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ScottP
= Cult of Ray =
USA
618 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 14:07:28
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The photos I've seen of dead mothers holding their dead children that Saddam gassed are even more sickening.
I'll bet he peed a little too. |
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kathryn
~ Selkie Bride ~
Belgium
15320 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 15:22:22
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quote:
Originally posted by ScottP
The photos I've seen of dead mothers holding their dead children that Saddam gassed are even more sickening.
When he first gassed civilians he enjoyed US support.
The execution (on a US base) beautifully shows, among other things, the short-sightedness of US foreign policy*. The execution also beautifully shows perfect timing on the behalf of Bush, who is to make his state of the union speech in Jan.
Meanwhile, going unpunished and unnamed are the US bigshots who supported him and turned a blind eye to his atrocities.
*this brings to mind how in the hours after the photo-op toppling of Saddam Hussein's statue, back when the US was allegedly bringing stability and freedom to the Iraquis, the U.S. soldiers guarded the Oil Reserves and left unprotected to the inevitalbe looters every other bedrock society place, from museums to schools.
I got some heaven in my head
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Daisy Girl
~ Abstract Brain ~
Belize
5305 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 15:46:16
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| Being a conspiracy theorist of sorts, you have to wonder if the timing of this (in addition to what K was saying) had anything to do with the Presedent Ford funeral coverage. Meaning- since it was a given a lot of press coverage would be given to the funeral of a president, did they bump up Saddam's hanging because they knew it would be downplayed?? |
Edited by - Daisy Girl on 12/30/2006 16:28:24 |
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Crispy Water
= Cult of Ray =
Canada
819 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 16:23:07
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Not being American, I don't know the atmosphere surrounding the death of an ex-prez, but I can't imagine they thought this execution would be treated as a mere distraction. However, the question does seem interesting in light of the fact that those sentenced to death with him will not be executed until some later date.
I'm as far from an expert on such things as you will find, but a friend of mine told me that this execution was timed to occur on the eve of a Muslim sacrificial feast (can't remember the name), historically cited as the ultimate time of forgiveness. Apparently even Hussein released prisoners from jail to mark the occasion. IF these are the facts, there is no way the Americans were not aware and this was in very poor taste even by the death penalty's standards.
I'm sure the timing was geared toward calming tensions in the region, though. Isn't that what all of this has been about? I should check today's headlines and see how it's working out.
Nothing is ever something. |
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kathryn
~ Selkie Bride ~
Belgium
15320 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 16:32:54
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quote:
Originally posted by Crispy Water
I'm as far from an expert on such things as you will find, but a friend of mine told me that this execution was timed to occur on the eve of a Muslim sacrificial feast (can't remember the name), historically cited as the ultimate time of forgiveness. Apparently even Hussein released prisoners from jail to mark the occasion. IF these are the facts, there is no way the Americans were not aware and this was in very poor taste even by the death penalty's standards.
Crispiness! Today's Globe and Mail has a little item about this very holiday and the timing's intended meaning.
Also, the NYTimes:
In His Death, as in Life, Hussein Divides Iraq Sects
By SABRINA TAVERNISE
Published: December 31, 2006
BAGHDAD, Dec. 30 — Saddam Hussein was dead, but his legacy was more alive than ever.
Even though their oppressor was dead, Shiites in northeastern Baghdad were giving no parties. There was no dancing in the streets. Even the office of the cleric Moktada al-Sadr was closed.
Some of the only open displays of jubilation were by officials, mostly Shiites, who had attended the hanging.
“This chapter of Iraqi history is over,” said Mowaffak al-Rubaie, Iraq’s national security adviser, speaking on national television early Saturday. “Let us forget it and live with each other.”
But after three years of grinding violence and abuses by the Shiite government security forces — all seeds planted by Mr. Hussein’s reign — trust has all but fallen away, and Sunni Arabs were reluctant to show acceptance. Their reactions showed just how far Iraqis have drifted apart.
“I’m not part of their world,” said Yusra Abdul Aziz, a teacher in the Sunni Arab enclave of Mansour. “They are not speaking about Iraq. They are speaking about themselves.”
In many ways, Iraq is living the legacy that Mr. Hussein built. And like a person abused, it appears capable of inflicting only more of the same. People disappear in the night. Bodies with drill holes surface in trash heaps. Government forces moonlight as killing squads.
Consider Ahmed Hillu, a 32-year-old tailor, whose suits hung on the walls of his narrow shop in Sadr City like a mute chorus. As a 6-year-old, he watched from a hiding spot in an empty area in northeastern Baghdad as elite members of Mr. Hussein’s regime gunned down large groups of Shiite opposition members. That area, an old dam called Qasr Attash, is now one of the common body-dumping groups for Shiite militias.
In Kufa, a city south of Baghdad that is holy to Shiites, a bomb in a fish market killed 36 people on Saturday, Iraqi authorities said. The town mayor said the police had identified the man, a Sunni from western Baghdad, and said that he had been killed by a mob at the scene.
Depressing new realities did not damp the Shiites’ joy, but they were still subdued in expressing it. Mr. Hillu, who lost two brothers to Mr. Hussein, said that he brought boxes of cookies and chocolate to his neighbors in the morning, when he learned about the execution. A stranger brought free orange juice into his and other shops along his block.
The execution took place early on a day that for Sunni Arabs was the beginning of the Id al-Adha holiday. (Shiites will begin celebrating on Sunday.) Mr. Hillu said the death “adds some more taste.”
If Shiites saw the hanging as a gift, most Sunnis were revolted that in what appeared to be a violation of Iraqi law, the execution was scheduled on a holiday of forgiveness.
“Actually, I felt angry,” Ms. Abdul Aziz said. “It’s not a proper time. I assure you, those who are feeling that this is a good time and a good judgment, they are not Iraqis.”
I got some heaven in my head
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Edited by - kathryn on 12/30/2006 16:36:39 |
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Daisy Girl
~ Abstract Brain ~
Belize
5305 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 16:42:55
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Crispy, that's a good point. I think your friend was refering to the Hajj.
I found this excerpt from an article:
"However, Saudi Arabia expressed irritation Saddam was executed during the hajj _ particularly on the first day of Eid al-Adha, the biggest Islamic holiday. Saudi authorities always worry the annual hajj _ attended this year by nearly three million pilgrims from around the world _ could see an eruption of political protests.
'It is a cause of surprise and disappointment that the death sentence was implemented on the first day of Eid, which is supposed to embody unity for Muslims,' the Saudi state news agency SUNA said in an editorial."
But to your point Kathryn- I had to go out of my way to find it- after doing a google news search under "hajj." I wouldn't have normally seen it because it was reported by the Canadian media.
Very interesting indeed.
Now if only the major networks and CNN would start covering the aftermath of Saddam's hanging vs. President Ford's funeral....
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Edited by - Daisy Girl on 12/30/2006 16:52:14 |
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darwin
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
5456 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 17:37:26
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From Juan Cole
http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2006/12/30/saddam/?source=whitelist
"The tribunal also had a unique sense of timing when choosing the day for Saddam's hanging. It was a slap in the face to Sunni Arabs. This weekend marks Eid al-Adha, the Holy Day of Sacrifice, on which Muslims commemorate the willingness of Abraham to sacrifice his son for God. Shiites celebrate it Sunday. Sunnis celebrate it Saturday –- and Iraqi law forbids executing the condemned on a major holiday. Hanging Saddam on Saturday was perceived by Sunni Arabs as the act of a Shiite government that had accepted the Shiite ritual calendar." |
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ProverbialCereal
- FB TabMaster -
USA
2953 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 21:05:20
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| So i guess the video of his hanging isn't on YouTube yet... |
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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
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ProverbialCereal
- FB TabMaster -
USA
2953 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 21:22:43
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Wow.. that was chilling indeed.
Was the camera operator being hung as well? Because that camera work sucked. |
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mantaraysallright
- FB Fan -
USA
110 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 23:50:48
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| that was terrible...camera work. I couldn't even see what was going on. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2006 : 04:48:45
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don´t worry, I´m sure they´ll do their hanging on pay-per-view soon so you won´t miss a thing.
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Gravy boat! Stay in the now! |
Edited by - Newo on 12/31/2006 04:49:16 |
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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2006 : 06:05:59
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According to the Drudge Report, which is where I found that link, it's a cellphone video. I guess that much was probably obvious. But I suspect the video was taken on the sly, because it's probably not within the law, so to speak, to be shooting personal video at Iraqi presidents' hangings.
Is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho? |
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starmekitten
-= Forum Pistolera =-
United Kingdom
6370 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2006 : 11:02:49
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Why would anyone watch that?
Idiot. |
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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2006 : 11:26:41
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Who doesn't have a little morbid curiosity?
Is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho? |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2006 : 11:28:04
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Morbid curiosity for us westerners.
To make sure he's really dead for the Iraqis.
__________
For Chrissakes have a cup of tea. |
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Crispy Water
= Cult of Ray =
Canada
819 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2006 : 11:41:44
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Thanks to kathryn, Daisy, and darwin for those excerpts. That sounds like exactly what I heard, just more detailed. Good to have confirmation on such claims.
Cole's comment about this violating Iraqi law interested me. Makes me think about whether such laws should be static or shifting with the prevailing doctrine.
I do question Tavernise's assertion that the country is living Hussein's legacy: how can one claim an untainted picture of his legacy when such powerful external influences brought him down? It seems to me the invasion and occupation have served as much baking soda on Hussein's vinegar.
As far as my previous comment about the timing, I'm not sure how to transmit sardonica on a computer, but I was aware of the reported violence.
Nothing is ever something. |
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Carl
- A 'Fifth' Catholic -
Ireland
11546 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2006 : 14:15:53
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To use the old cliche, I didn't shed any tears...but I don't see the point in people wallowing in it and sating their bloodlust...especially people who weren't affected by him outside of the Middle East. Just looking at some of the tabloid headlines today...'Hung With His Own Rope' 'You Could Hear His Neck Break', etc. I mean, are we still living in the Dark Ages?!
Merry Christmas! |
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2006 : 22:39:48
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Just a student of the wind, a slow learner as it were.
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whoreatthedoor
> Teenager of the Year <
Spain
2873 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2007 : 01:23:40
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Sometimes this site scares me.
This time we ride roller coasters into the ocean
We feel no emotion as we spiral down to the world |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11690 Posts |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2007 : 09:51:53
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Thanks Dean.
That was very enlightening.
Sounds like he would've been good if he could've stayed second in command. Narcissism & ego always seem to get in the way.
Its interesting that in all the news items I've read not one said this of his final letter;
"I call on you not to hate because hate does not leave a space for a person to be fair and it makes you blind and closes all doors of thinking," he wrote.
He also called on Iraqis not to hate the people of the countries that had driven him from power.
In fact it seemed the exact opposite was reported.
Either way...
__________
For Chrissakes have a cup of tea. |
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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2007 : 12:42:43
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quote:
Originally posted by whoreatthedoor
Sometimes this site scares me.
Care to elaborate?
Is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho? |
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kathryn
~ Selkie Bride ~
Belgium
15320 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2007 : 19:21:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Carolynanna
his final letter;
"I call on you not to hate because hate does not leave a space for a person to be fair and it makes you blind and closes all doors of thinking," he wrote.
That's gonna be my new forum sig! Thanks, Fofanna!
I got some heaven in my head
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Carl
- A 'Fifth' Catholic -
Ireland
11546 Posts |
Posted - 01/03/2007 : 09:31:10
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quote:
Originally posted by coastline
quote:
Originally posted by whoreatthedoor
Sometimes this site scares me.
Care to elaborate?
 Boo!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/6238115.stm
Saddam scenes 'deplored' by Brown
Gordon Brown has condemned as "deplorable" the way in which Saddam Hussein's execution was conducted.
The chancellor told BBC One's Sunday AM the manner of the former Iraqi leader's hanging was "completely unacceptable".
Mr Brown, whose comments come after mobile phone footage of the hanging showed Saddam Hussein being taunted, said he was against the death penalty.
Deputy PM John Prescott has already condemned the scenes as deplorable, but Tony Blair has yet to comment.
Mr Brown said: "Now that we know the full picture of what happened, we can sum this up as a deplorable set of events.
"It is something, of course, which the Iraqi government has now expressed its anxiety and shame at.
"It has done nothing to lessen tensions between the Shia and Sunni communities."
He added: "Even those people unlike me who are in favour of capital punishment found this completely unacceptable and I am pleased that there is now an inquiry into this and I hope lessons in this area will be learnt, as we learn other lessons about Iraq."
On Wednesday the Iraqi government began an inquiry into the unofficial footage, which appeared on the internet hours after the execution.
Iraqi PM Nouri Maliki has also said his government could review relations with any country which criticised the execution of ex-leader Saddam Hussein.
He said the hanging was a "domestic affair" for the benefit of Iraq's unity.
Shia slogans
Last week Mr Prescott, in charge of the country while the prime minister was on holiday, also described the filming of the execution as "deplorable".
Mr Blair has said he will speak about the 30 December execution next week, although Downing Street said the PM supported an Iraqi investigation into the hanging.
A spokeswoman said that Mr Blair will say something about the execution at "a time of his choosing".
BBC political correspondent Laura Kuenssberg said Mr Brown's comment "not only pre-empts Tony Blair but also sort of boxes him into a corner".
The prime minister's silence has already prompted the Liberal Democrats to question his leadership, she said.
Education Secretary and deputy leadership candidate Alan Johnson told the Observer he also had concerns about the way the execution was carried out.
"I agree with John Prescott's remarks about the way it was handled and I am an opponent of the death penalty.
"But it was a matter for the Iraqi people to make that judgment.
"What happened at the end shouldn't detract from the terrible crimes that Saddam committed."
Initial Iraqi government film showed Saddam being executed in a relatively dignified manner, however mobile phone footage emerged showing Saddam - a Sunni - being taunted with Shia slogans.
Following Mr Brown's remarks, Liberal Democrat leader Sir Menzies Campbell said: "The prime minister's continuing silence is deafening.
"His unwillingness to condemn the shameful scenes surrounding Saddam Hussein's execution does him no credit." |
Edited by - Carl on 01/07/2007 13:13:26 |
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Saddam Hussein's hanging
"Now you're officially my woman. Kudos. I can't say I don't envy you."