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gracie
= Cult of Ray =
United Kingdom
573 Posts |
 Posted - 11/06/2003 : 10:31:27
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I was reading a newspaper today and apparently the new trend for
women who go stright back to work after giving birth but still want their babies to benefit from breast milk are employing a wet nurse to feed their babies.
I don't have any children myself but when I do I fully intend to breast feed because of the health benefits for mother and child, however Idon't think i could stomach the idea of another women breastfeeding it.
What do the rest of you think about it, would you allow a stranger to breast feed your baby? |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 10:33:45
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i don't know, but i like the term "wet nurse" for some reason..
mijn vriendin kan geen orgasme krijgen |
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mun chien andalusia
= Quote Accumulator =
Italy
2139 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 11:41:35
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i think that kids shouldn't even get close to "wet" nurses,at least not until they become 18 years old and then only if they are male.
 join the cult of errol\and you can have a beer\without having to quit smoking
www.munchienandalusia.too.it
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Little Black Francis
> Teenager of the Year <
3648 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 11:55:57
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I was adopted. I got fake booby milk : (
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ain't it funny how the "don't fuck with me!" nooch |
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blackpurse
= Cult of Ray =
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 12:01:39
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quote:
Originally posted by gracie
I was reading a newspaper today and apparently the new trend for
women who go stright back to work after giving birth but still want their babies to benefit from breast milk are employing a wet nurse to feed their babies.
I don't have any children myself but when I do I fully intend to breast feed because of the health benefits for mother and child, however Idon't think i could stomach the idea of another women breastfeeding it.
What do the rest of you think about it, would you allow a stranger to breast feed your baby?
These people don't get hte point of breastfeeding. Part of why breast milk is the best is that its specifically designed for YOUR baby. Your milk works best becasue its got the antibodies YOU (and presumably baby) are exposed to, its composition is timed with the age of the baby. Also, a major reason to breastfeed is the closeness it brings between mother and baby. Plus its WAY cheaper than formula (*at $8 a quart!). If you're going to employ a wet nurse, you might as well just go with formula.
The only instance I would consider a wet nurse is if I temporarily had some condition that didn't allow me to use my milk (some virus that I can't manufacture antibodies for, or requires treatment that would compromise my milk.) At that point, I would just switch to formula for that time being.
Wet nurses were employed in the days when women "of means" didn't want to sully themselves with the whole breastfeeding thing. Again, we're missing the point here.
In case you're wondering, yes, Sammy is BF, and thriving wonderfully. I'm finally getting over hte soreness.
"Sacred cows make the best burgers!" |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 12:23:01
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| Is it wrong that I want a wet nurse to breast suckle me? |
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realmeanmotorscutor
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1764 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 12:45:05
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damn, I thought this would be a picture post for wet nurses.
 "I joined the Cult of Popeye / The CoF required my good eye" |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 12:47:32
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Here |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 12:53:54
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or, if you prefer...
mijn vriendin kan geen orgasme krijgen |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 12:55:26
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quote:
Originally posted by floop
or, if you prefer...
wet nurse
mijn vriendin kan geen orgasme krijgen
Uh yes....I preferher.
mamma...baby hungy!!!! |
Edited by - the swimmer on 11/06/2003 12:55:55 |
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realmeanmotorscutor
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1764 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 13:09:43
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uh oh, what have I started? but . . ah . . thanks floop :)
"I joined the Cult of Popeye / The CoF required my good eye" |
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El Barto
= Song DB Master =
USA
4020 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2003 : 19:32:54
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Where can I sign up for one of these wet nurses?
 "I joined the Cult of Clops / If I were you, I'd sleep with one eye open." |
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blackpurse
= Cult of Ray =
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 11/07/2003 : 18:27:09
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quote:
Originally posted by El Barto
Where can I sign up for one of these wet nurses?
"I joined the Cult of Clops / If I were you, I'd sleep with one eye open."
Adults nursing from a wet nurse isn't an unheard of concept. Which Steinbeck novel was it that ends with Rose of Sharon losing her baby, but the Joads come upon an old man who's starving to death, but can't hold any regular food down, so Rose of Sharon, engorged from her stillborn child, offers her breast -- the old man is embarassed but then knows its life or death, and the last line of the novel is "Rose of Sharon looked up and smiled mysteriously..." ??? for the life of me I can't remember the title of the novel -- but its the famous one you have to read for American Lit class -- got made into a movie with Henry Fonda as Tom Joad (oh this is killing me!) but you can get the breastfeeding scene wasn't even considered!!!!
"Sacred cows make the best burgers!" |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 11/07/2003 : 19:21:31
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i think "The Wet Nurses" would be a cool name for a chick band.
 long live the coalition! |
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realmeanmotorscutor
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1764 Posts |
Posted - 11/07/2003 : 19:28:00
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I think it'd be a cool name for any band. Good thinking floop.
"I joined the Cult of Popeye / The CoF required my good eye" |
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darwin
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
5455 Posts |
Posted - 11/07/2003 : 23:58:55
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| Grapes of Wrath. Steinbeck for $400, please. |
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blackpurse
= Cult of Ray =
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 11/08/2003 : 12:12:44
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quote:
Originally posted by darwin
Grapes of Wrath. Steinbeck for $400, please.
Thanks. It was driving me nuts. I looked in my bookshelf and couldn't find my copy, but all that was going through my head was "The Sound and the Fury" but that was Faulkner. Dammit, realists, but not Southern realists....
Embarassing Ironic note: my degree's in English...
"Sacred cows make the best burgers!" |
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darwin
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
5455 Posts |
Posted - 11/08/2003 : 14:04:15
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| Have you listened to Springsteen's Ghost of Tom Joad? I think that's fantastic album, up there with Nebraska. |
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2003 : 11:23:30
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Thanks Veronica..i hadn't really considered why they brought wet nurses in (ignorantly assuming there were 'problems'..)
Okay..this whole 'i don't want my kid drinking the milk from another woman' thing really confounds me.
Recently, there was a story of a mom(1) who sued another mom(2), because she(2) was breast-feeding her(1) baby (while babysitting and running out of food or something..)
Now..i know most people get the feeling 'this is disgusting! She *should* be sued or something!'
But....
We drink cows milk. And when you have a glass of milk, it's actually most likely from THOUSANDS of different cows.
AND - people are willing to feed this to their kids.
Why is the shit- and pus-contaminated milk from thousands of hormone and antibiotic-ridden non-humans so commonly acceptable, where as human mom is somehow considered repulsive?
Got me Charlie.
Check out my project www.DairyInfo.ca for info. =) |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2003 : 14:56:20
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| shit and pus. mmmmmm. thanks for that visual. i'm going to go have a bowl of cereal now. |
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glacial906
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1738 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2003 : 15:17:49
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| I would be righteously offended if some other woman took the liberty to breast-feed my daughter (as I'm sure would be my wife) but my daughter only bottle-fed. For one thing, as I think has been pointed out, the milk that a mother produces is pretty particular to her own child, as far as the nutrients that it produces...plus, I would think that breast-feeding would be a pretty intimate experience between a mother and her child, and it just be a hideous breach of that closeness for another woman to take it upon herself to do that. I don't think that human mom's milk is considered repulsive (although I sure as hell wouldn't drink it nowadays, anyway!) but it would be more of a societal issue than anything else. Like if I were to go up and grab my friends' wife's ass or something. |
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anazgnos
= Cult of Ray =
USA
384 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2003 : 15:21:46
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awww...the cow's milk we drink is barely even related to the fluid that came out of the cow. Some people propose a 'back to whole milk' movement, where you actually have to scoop the layer of pus and shit off before you drink it, warm. I love the people who are always coming up with some new everyday product that turns out be deadly, or at least disgusting. Like "MILK IS PUS AND SHIT", or "CORN FLAKES IS DEAD SILVERFISH" or "BEN & JERRYS = INSTANT DEATH".
 "the Cult of Eric: / where a man feels like a king / and a king feels like some kinda crazy super king" |
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glacial906
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1738 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2003 : 15:24:43
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| Your link didn't work. |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2003 : 15:27:59
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quote:
Originally posted by anazgnos
awww...the cow's milk we drink is barely even related to the fluid that came out of the cow. Some people propose a 'back to whole milk' movement, where you actually have to scoop the layer of pus and shit off before you drink it, warm. I love the people who are always coming up with some new everyday product that turns out be deadly, or at least disgusting. Like "MILK IS PUS AND SHIT", or "CORN FLAKES IS DEAD SILVERFISH" or "BEN & JERRYS = INSTANT DEATH".
"the Cult of Eric: / where a man feels like a king / and a king feels like some kinda crazy super king"
Corn Flakes is dead silverfish?! that's fucked up. |
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anazgnos
= Cult of Ray =
USA
384 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2003 : 16:18:20
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quote:
Originally posted by glacial906
Your link didn't work.
it wasn't supposed to be a link...it's just a word that happens to have three w's |
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glacial906
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1738 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2003 : 16:22:01
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| I thought it was a cleverly-incorporated link or something. Damn forum code. |
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Steak n Sabre
* Dog in the Sand *
Uzbekistan
1013 Posts |
Posted - 11/10/2003 : 08:32:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Noisy
Thanks Veronica..i hadn't really considered why they brought wet nurses in (ignorantly assuming there were 'problems'..)
Okay..this whole 'i don't want my kid drinking the milk from another woman' thing really confounds me.
Recently, there was a story of a mom(1) who sued another mom(2), because she(2) was breast-feeding her(1) baby (while babysitting and running out of food or something..)
Now..i know most people get the feeling 'this is disgusting! She *should* be sued or something!'
......(snip)
We drink cows milk. And when you have a glass of milk, it's actually most likely from THOUSANDS of different cows.
AND - people are willing to feed this to their kids.
Why is the shit- and pus-contaminated milk from thousands of hormone and antibiotic-ridden non-humans so commonly acceptable, where as human mom is somehow considered repulsive?
Got me Charlie.
I'm familiar with this case. It was a day care situation, and the child was inconcolably crying. Desperate, the worker put the baby to her breast. Her heart was in teh right place. If I were the mother in that situation, I would have appreciated being asked first, but I'm not about to sue. My concerns would be more that "Was the woman healthy, not carrying anything that could be transferred to my baby like AIDS or such?" The plaintiff in this case was simply pissed that the woman violated a trust. Again, I would have been annoyed, but I understand that when a baby is inconsolably crying, you'll try ANYTHING to soothe them (and subsequently get them to shut up!). Really, a baby's inconsolable cries are not only annoying, they're heartbreaking.
 The Cult of Frank: You've got questions, We've got answers |
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gracie
= Cult of Ray =
United Kingdom
573 Posts |
Posted - 11/10/2003 : 11:11:09
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| Do babies actually cry tears or do they just make the noise? |
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blackpurse
= Cult of Ray =
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 11/10/2003 : 15:29:28
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BTW, Steaknsabre didn't post to this thread. I did. We share the same computer and it was logged in as him. As I am now logged in as me, I can't make changes to his post. So just be aware the above post was by me, not him.
Though I doubt he disagrees. He's just not as passionate about this issue as I am, inasmuch as he's not affected by it the way I am.
At least I live in Wisconsin, which has something of a half-assed "right to publicly BF" law. All Wisconsin really does is exempt BF from the definition of "indecent exposure."
Now THERE's a topic.
"Sacred cows make the best burgers!" |
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blackpurse
= Cult of Ray =
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 11/10/2003 : 15:30:54
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quote:
Originally posted by gracie
Do babies actually cry tears or do they just make the noise?
Newborns don't have tears yet. They start to develop them around, depending on the baby 4-8 weeks. Sammy is just starting to.
It doesn't matter. The facial expressions are there-- they might as well be shedding tears. When Sammy cries, you'd think his whole world is falling apart on him. Poor little guy.
"Sacred cows make the best burgers!" |
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VoVat
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
9168 Posts |
Posted - 11/10/2003 : 15:43:55
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Are you sure corn flakes aren't really babies' tears?
-Nathan
And how does lemur's skin reflect the sea?
http://vovat.blogspot.com/ |
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 11/10/2003 : 18:21:10
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I could see the concern for TD's, but really, how many TD's are in breast milk? Prolly not many..
Dioxin, and other toxins would be at the top of my list of concerns, to be honest.
I doubt that another mother feeding a baby could really do any harm. Not ideal, of course, but i'd be willing to wager a lot that it's infinately healthier than milk from a cow, or vegan sources even.
The 'customization' can't be too significant, unless the guest breast-feeder is visiting from some very different climate, eh? |
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apl4eris
~ Abstract Brain ~
USA
4800 Posts |
Posted - 11/10/2003 : 22:10:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Noisy
I could see the concern for TD's, but really, how many TD's are in breast milk? Prolly not many..
Not true - many STDs and other diseases, including HIV/AIDS, can be transmitted via breastmilk, and others via open sores during feeding:
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/english/westnile/pregnancy.html
"Can WN virus be passed to a child through breast milk?
There is evidence that this is possible. In one case in the United States, a woman was infected with WN virus after the birth of her child. She breast-fed her baby, and the baby later tested positive for WN virus infection."
STD transmission:
http://www.parentsplace.com/expert/lactation/qas/0,,239097_106307,00.html
quote:
Originally posted by Dave Noisy
The 'customization' can't be too significant, unless the guest breast-feeder is visiting from some very different climate, eh?
Also not so - the mother's milk is gene-specific for the baby in its levels and types of antibodies, etc.:
http://www.drgreene.com/21_552.html
http://medicalreporter.health.org/tmr0297/breastfeed0297.html
http://www.med.umich.edu/1libr/womens/breast05.htm
You may want to read up a little more on this topic in light of your anti-dairy interests, so that you will be better able to argue your points. Here's a coupla sites that may be helpful:
www.lalecheleague.org
http://www.eldis.org/static/DOC688.htm
 "I partied with the Cult of Frank / Bob ate all the dip" |
Edited by - apl4eris on 11/10/2003 22:15:12 |
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blackpurse
= Cult of Ray =
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2003 : 08:16:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Noisy
I could see the concern for TD's, but really, how many TD's are in breast milk? Prolly not many..
Dioxin, and other toxins would be at the top of my list of concerns, to be honest.
I doubt that another mother feeding a baby could really do any harm. Not ideal, of course, but i'd be willing to wager a lot that it's infinately healthier than milk from a cow, or vegan sources even.
The 'customization' can't be too significant, unless the guest breast-feeder is visiting from some very different climate, eh?
YUou'd definitely want the test the "guest" feeder for TDs. the "customization" wouldn't be significant for isolated incidents, but to get the full benefit of BM, you really need to have the birth mother (or an adoptive mother who has practiced re-lactation). A wet nurse is not in that category.
But I do agree with your earlier point. I was on another board -- i think I mentioned this on the vegan thread -- and pointed out "how can you get all up in arms about another mother's milk (absent of the disease issue) yet you freely drink ANOTHER SPECIE'S milk. go figure." You wouldn't believe how many flames I got for that.
I drink cow's milk and eat cheese, but I did want to point out the hypocrisy.
"Sacred cows make the best burgers!" |
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2003 : 17:32:47
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Thanks apl!
The article on STD's and breastmilk don't actually say that STD's are carried through the breastmilk. It's more to do with the contact. (With the possible exception of HIV/AIDS, but even then, it's left in the realm of 'possible'.) West Nile is an exception, but it's not *too* common.. I would agree with concern for other TD's tho.
I couldn't find anything about 'gene-specific' milk (short of the HUMAN gene.)
As i understand it, the composition of the milk changes, as the baby grows, to match his/her requirements, but i don't see how another human baby wouldn't benefit if they're in the same 'stage of growth'.
I don't know if there's a huge difference between milk from different mothers, unless, as i mentioned, they're from different climates, in which case it would make sense there'd be different antibodies present.
Glad you agree Veronica! I'm not surprised they'd flame you, it's how they were raised.. |
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apl4eris
~ Abstract Brain ~
USA
4800 Posts |
Posted - 11/11/2003 : 19:33:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Noisy
Thanks apl!
Sure. This topic interests me, as I imagine I'll be needing to know as much as possible about breastfeeding benefits, etc. in the next few years, if I finally decide to have a baby :)
quote:
The article on STD's and breastmilk don't actually say that STD's are carried through the breastmilk.
Well, that's not quite true that *no* STDs are transmitted via the milk:
"If Hepatitis B is diagnosed, your infant should be vaccinated and breastfeeding can continue."
HIV/AIDS is transferred via breastfeeding - that article was not very scientific - here is a better source:
http://www.niaid.nih.gov/aidstherapeutics/research/perinatal.htm
quote:
I couldn't find anything about 'gene-specific' milk (short of the HUMAN gene.)
I agree, in the context of the sources I gave you, the phrase "gene-specific" was misleading - those articles indicate that a mother's level and type of antibodies, etc., are specific for the baby's needs and stage in development, and changes accordingly during each phase of development. I have heard and read elsewhere about studies that show there *are* gene-specific ingredients.
IMHO, the main difference between humans drinking milk from multiple and/or anonymous animals and a stranger breastfeeding your baby without permission is the element of intimacy in the mother-child bond. Besides the concern for the baby's health, it is a serious invasion of a relationship, somewhat akin to catching someone else kissing your spouse. Drinking milk from a carton is for nourishment - the act of breastfeeding is more than just a function of physical nourishment, it is also necessary for psychological growth and bonding.
"I partied with the Cult of Frank / Bob ate all the dip" |
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