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NimrodsSon
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1938 Posts |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6196 Posts |
 Posted - 05/15/2003 : 14:44:45
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it's quite nice!
better than devils workshop and BLD
''it's not a box, it's a submarine'' |
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oddball
- FB Fan -
Germany
242 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2003 : 15:02:08
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| excellent cover! |
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2003 : 15:05:57
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| god I hope that isn't really going to be the title of the album. an album title provides an opportunity to say almost anything, and this is what they pick? doesn't matter what the backstory is: that title is not going to help move units. that title is about pathos and weakness. |
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mereubu
= FB QuizMistress =
USA
2677 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2003 : 16:42:16
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| Well, considering they've already put the art up on the site, I'm guessing it is, and I'm not sure Frank really gives a flying fuck about moving units. From what I understand, it IS an album about pathos and weakness and that title seems appropriate to me. What else should he call an album of sad songs: "Boo-Fucking-Hoo"? |
Edited by - mereubu on 05/15/2003 16:43:47 |
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carsonwerner
= Cult of Ray =
USA
254 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2003 : 18:10:40
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| When the cat was loading I was a little worried, but the pedal steel part makes it pretty cool. |
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2003 : 18:58:37
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quote:
Originally posted by mereubu
Well, considering they've already put the art up on the site, I'm guessing it is, and I'm not sure Frank really gives a flying fuck about moving units. From what I understand, it IS an album about pathos and weakness and that title seems appropriate to me. What else should he call an album of sad songs: "Boo-Fucking-Hoo"?
Lou Reed called one "Berlin". Frank's title may be appropriate to the subject matter but hardly to the sales rack. And of course Frank gives flying fuck about sales. |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2003 : 19:31:11
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i think the album title is great. plus, it's Frank. he could name his album "Feces Pie" and i'd think it was cool..
i completely agree with mereubu though.. the title seems appropriate.. and with someone as smart and literate as Frank, you can't really take his titles at face value.. i'm sure it's not meant to be read in such a straightforward, literal way.
i think the lucky cat things is very cool.. and marks the first time any kind of asian imagery has appeared on a Frank album, am i right?
my only criticism might be the font choice for album title part.. but hey. |
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marcusb
= Cult of Ray =
USA
308 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2003 : 20:03:40
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| JEOPARDY! |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2003 : 22:47:46
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| I liked Madams at Nine about... well, nine times better. But I suppose such things are subjective. A decent little cover. |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6196 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 05:27:32
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Yes the font is weak!
I would have said that in my first reaction
But I couldn't remember the word ''font''
''it's not a box, it's a submarine'' |
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mereubu
= FB QuizMistress =
USA
2677 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 06:24:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
Lou Reed called one "Berlin". Frank's title may be appropriate to the subject matter but hardly to the sales rack. And of course Frank gives flying fuck about sales.
Maybe he should have called it that, then: "[I Give a Flying Fuck About] Moving Units."
I'm just teasing, really, but while it's clear that the man is certainly good at managing his business, he must not plot out his every move based on commercial concerns or we'd have had five Pixies reunion tours by now. |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 06:56:42
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doesn't it almost seem like the title "show me your tears" is a play on the phrase "show me your tits" ? i could be way off on this one, but it just occured to me.
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Jettison
- FB Fan -
USA
228 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 07:41:40
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Good one Floop.
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mereubu
= FB QuizMistress =
USA
2677 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 07:49:38
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| Yeah, I like that. You could also read it as a double meaning--both tears and tears (i.e., rips, wounds); show me your pain. Y'know, pain, tits, whatever. |
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 08:16:32
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quote:
Originally posted by floop
he could name his album "Feces Pie" and i'd think it was cool..
i completely agree with mereubu though.. the title seems appropriate.. and with someone as smart and literate as Frank, you can't really take his titles at face value.. i'm sure it's not meant to be read in such a straightforward, literal way.
Quite honestly, "Feces Pie" would be better. I'm sure Frank has sound and even deep reasons for going the "Tears" route but the title is simply lame. While those of us who love Frank will not let the title influence our reaction to the music, it nonetheless won't impress potential new listeners or the old nothing-but-Pixies crowd. Being true to your muse and not selling out does not commit one to a title that only hurts the appeal of the package. No big deal, but Why? |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 08:28:10
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| whether you like the title or not is a matter of opinion, but i really don't think an album title has that much impact on sales (which you're really concerned about). the main thing affecting sales is marketing.. how much exposure the album gets. with Frank, it's kind of beside the point because he gets what he gets, which isn't very much at all relatively speaking. he gets virtually zero radio play (especially on commercial radio), and very little press. do you really think having a more snappy title is going to make sales skyrocket? i'd be willing to be that cover "art" has more of an affect than the title. if you're just talking about people browsing through cd racks. |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 08:39:12
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Erebus.
You don't even get it, I think.
In my old age, I've learned that everyone is entitled to their own opinion though, so I guess I'll just live and let live.
Oh, uh, nothing against you personally, Erebus, it's just....do we like the same Frank Black? Are you sure you're not thinking of the
"I give a flying Fuck about selling TONS of UNITS based on my good looks and socially and time oriented relevant titles and subject matter" Frank Black in the alternate BIZARRO universe? Because if you are, I see your point.
If not, I really think you should, you know, think about it.
"Winter blows through my coat"
the what four http://www.mp3.com/phelan |
Edited by - the swimmer on 05/16/2003 08:43:33 |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 08:42:23
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quote:
Originally posted by floop
whether you like the title or not is a matter of opinion, but i really don't think an album title has that much impact on sales (which you're really concerned about). the main thing affecting sales is marketing.. how much exposure the album gets. with Frank, it's kind of beside the point because he gets what he gets, which isn't very much at all relatively speaking. he gets virtually zero radio play (especially on commercial radio), and very little press. do you really think having a more snappy title is going to make sales skyrocket? i'd be willing to be that cover "art" has more of an affect than the title. if you're just talking about people browsing through cd racks.
Again, excellent point, Floop.
I am sure I have bought MANY albums because of the title.
"Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band" sounds like a bunch of Kansas City faggots.
I hate Club Bands, especially one's ran by eccentric military people. |
Edited by - the swimmer on 05/16/2003 08:44:17 |
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PsychicTwin
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1772 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 09:06:36
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quote:
Originally posted by the swimmer
"Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band" sounds like a bunch of Kansas City faggots.
I hate Club Bands, especially one's ran by eccentric military people.
LOL |
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 09:17:17
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quote:
Originally posted by floop
whether you like the title or not is a matter of opinion, but i really don't think an album title has that much impact on sales (which you're really concerned about)
Actually I regret even mentioning the relation to appeal and sales because that is not even secondary to my primary concern that it is just a poor title. It's that simple. My emphasis is not sales as that has nothing to do with my love of his music. Frankly I'm proud of the guy for his integrity, as I assume we all are. |
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Perhaps
- FB Fan -
133 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 09:58:30
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Is it a bit premature to judge titles without knowing the content from first to last track? If I rented the movie LOVE STORY and it was a bunch of Kung Fu shit, i'd be a bit miffed. If it was a bunch of love shit, then I could start talking about it (not that I'd really want to or anything); e.g., whether title matched said committment. Fact is, we don't really know what FB has in ways of expressing this stuff. That's why I buy the albums - to hear the concept.
As for "feces pie", again, I'd have to see the track list... |
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Atheist4Catholics
= Cult of Ray =
USA
925 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 11:20:28
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I'm sure the title will make more sense when you hear the album. Frank has never been one to do anything flippantly. Everything has a purpose and usually works on many levels.
Most FB fans who are still pining for the Pixies era are probably put off by the title because of it's passivity. The Pixies were always very aggressive and abstract and it seems (especially lately) that Frank is steering away from that into a more subtle and personal style of writing.
Aside from that, consider how many albums and songs this man has titled thus far and give him a chance to do something different.
By the way Swimmer, your Beatles point is well put. Even the name "The Beatles" is about as dumb as it gets.
Is "Wish You Were Here" better? How about these:
"Out of Time"
"Everybody Else is Doing It, So Why Can't We?"
"Marvin the Album"
"Melancollie and The Infinite Sadness"
These are all really dumb titles (especially The Cranberries one), but they've each sold millions of records. Maybe no one will buy "Show Me Your Tears" as an impulse purchase just from seeing the CD in the store, but seriously, how big of an impact will that be?
www.mp3.com/clootie |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 11:29:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
quote:
Originally posted by floop
whether you like the title or not is a matter of opinion, but i really don't think an album title has that much impact on sales (which you're really concerned about)
Actually I regret even mentioning the relation to appeal and sales because that is not even secondary to my primary concern that it is just a poor title. It's that simple. My emphasis is not sales as that has nothing to do with my love of his music. Frankly I'm proud of the guy for his integrity, as I assume we all are.
Why is it a poor title? How can you judge that before you have heard the entire album?
I am not saying that everything that comes from the ENTITY OF FRANK is 100% perfection. I mean, jesus, CULT OF RAY anyone?
But seriously, honest to goodness, why are you so vehemently opposed to "Show Me Your Tears"?
Make a case that at least we can say, "I can see your angle." Don't just say THAT SUCKS!
What if on this album....and this is just an if....there is one of the most brilliant songs that ever touched you way down deep in the pit of your cynical heart.
And in that song that opened your eyes was the line, "Show Me Your Tears..."
Would you still hate it?
I mean, I hated the title "Attack of the Clones" but I still...wait, no....wait, that movie sucked.
It's just, I can't grasp this hatred you have for the title. It's just a title. |
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 12:16:12
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quote:
Originally posted by the swimmer
Why is it a poor title? How can you judge that before you have heard the entire album?
why are you so vehemently opposed to "Show Me Your Tears"?
Make a case that at least we can say, "I can see your angle." Don't just say THAT SUCKS!
What if on this album....and this is just an if....there is one of the most brilliant songs that ever touched you way down deep in the pit of your cynical heart.
And in that song that opened your eyes was the line, "Show Me Your Tears..."
Would you still hate it?
It's just, I can't grasp this hatred you have for the title. It's just a title.
Hatred? I don't believe I said I hated the title. No matter. My disapproval of the title hinges entirely on it as a title, not upon the relationship of the title to contents. I suspect that even I will be able to see why such a title is appropriate to the music. However, at this point I haven't heard the music on the album and so am restricted to judging on the basis of superficial appearances. So, what is off-putting about that title? Much as I am sympathetic to the increasing reach of the psychotherapeutic industry, I think we, as a society, have gone overboard in our willingness to excuse ourselves as victims. Anything that hints at promotion of the Alan Alda, sensitive male, archetype pretty much reeks to me. Enough on the healthiness of masculine emoting! I don't want to see tears, and I don't want my main man appearing to sanction the same. Now I grant that there is almost certainly much more to what Frank is getting at here, perhaps all of which I could accept and endorse, but as a title it's a loser. If I knew nothing about Frank it would make me think he's a wimp. Yes, I know all the cliches such as "it's the strong man who can show his feelings" and all that, but the societal benefits of that remain controversial. Even if he has to go down that road he might have chosen a more subtle manner of expressing it. I don't regard myself as committing the sin of "judging the book by its cover"; rather, it's a matter of judging the COVER by the cover. It could be that my favorite line on the album will include the title phrase. Nonetheless I can't help thinking that five years from now seeing that title on a spine in my cd rack will still make me cringe, albeit ever so slightly. After all, how important is it? Almost certainly not worthy of all this, but it has been fun anyway. |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 12:44:38
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One time in college, I got into an argument with my roommate because he said that women were weaker than men because the bible said so.
It reminds me of this discussion. |
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PsychicTwin
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1772 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 12:51:38
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| OH come on, you're doubting the Bible??? That infallible fountain of truth? Shame on you! |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 13:31:27
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quote:
Originally posted by PsychicTwin
OH come on, you're doubting the Bible??? That infallible fountain of truth? Shame on you!
Ha! I know, how dare me. There really was an Arky Arky where animals they came by twosies twosies, elephants and Kangaroosies, roosies.
And men are weak if they cry or show emotions.
What the fuck, Erebus? I mean, are you serious or are you just pulling our legs?
You think it's a terrible title and you'll cringe upon looking at it because it shows emotions?
I am beside myself with the prospect of you being serious. Wow. You are a guy that I really would never like to meet.
Anyway, you're right, it doesn't warrant all this discussion. As Brian Fellow would say, that's crazy. |
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ObfuscateByWill
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1887 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 13:40:40
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Phooey!
I can't say I like the title or the album art.
*Me Fail English? That's Unpossible! |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 13:47:59
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quote:
Originally posted by ObfuscateByWill
Phooey!
I can't say I like the title or the album art.
*Me Fail English? That's Unpossible!
Phooey?
PHOOEY?
To tell you the truth, on my list of all time suck album covers, Frank Black is the King since 4AD stopped doing it.
I don't care about looks though and what sounds good is the songs. The titles are titles. Pistolero, Dog In The Sand, Black Letter Days, Devil's Workshop, what's so special about that collection of titles. Nothing really. But then again, what is a GREAT TITLE.
Please enlighten us phillistines as to what title you would prefer... |
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PsychicTwin
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1772 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 13:49:22
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| Just to give my two cents....my very first reaction upon looking at the new cover was one of skepticism and dissatisfaction. But now I kind of like it. I guess the only thing I would change would be making "Show Me Your Tears" a different font. |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 13:50:37
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I think a great title would be
PHILLIP ROOTERMAN FLIES A BURNING PHOENIX INTO THE HEART OF EVIL AND IS REBORN IN A NUCLEAR-CATALISMIC BIG BANG OF FUNK. |
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the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 13:52:03
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quote:
Originally posted by PsychicTwin
Just to give my two cents....my very first reaction upon looking at the new cover was one of skepticism and dissatisfaction. But now I kind of like it. I guess the only thing I would change would be making "Show Me Your Tears" a different font.
Doesn't it fit with the shitty fonts of Black Letter Days and Devil's Workshop?
I mean, are we really having a discussion on cover art. There have been no ground breaking covers since the birth of the cd anyway. |
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Perhaps
- FB Fan -
133 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 14:24:32
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| sounds like some of you folks are starting to show us your tears... |
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mereubu
= FB QuizMistress =
USA
2677 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 15:43:22
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| Ahahahaaaa! |
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sarah spinart
- FB Fan -
77 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2003 : 19:39:26
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sorry, but i am afraid that "show me your tears" is most definitely the title. as fb himself says, "it's too late for to go back now."
to be perfectly honest, i think that it could be called "feces pie" and it wouldn't matter in the least because it's one of the fucking best records i have heard in a long time. 
and i actually think "marvin the album" is one of the best album titles ever. |
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