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Troubles A Foot
= Cult of Ray =

USA
361 Posts

Posted - 09/14/2019 :  19:49:51  Show Profile  Visit Troubles A Foot's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by pot


What about No Black No Pixies?

I'd say that's going to be hard to argue.





Not sure I get it. There's a big difference between the writer and lead singer of 99% of the songs and the bass player/back-up vocalist. Without the person writing the songs, there's no songs. That's an irreplaceable element. Otherwise it's just a cover band.
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sdon
= Cult of Ray =

France
764 Posts

Posted - 09/14/2019 :  23:09:51  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by natenate101

quote:
Originally posted by tamefan

I'm in Bird of Prey bliss and loving Frank's theatrical delivery. For example, his use of onomatopoeia in the first verse (ďI'll set my broken bone / With a twist and a crackĒ). It's a fantastic little effect that shows off the band's confidence and attention to detail.



Iím with you, itís my favorite vocal performance of his on the album in terms of the verses. Sounds just slightly unhinged. Still desire more of that but the wide range of deliveries on the album all work well considering. The man is just good at his job. My respect level for him continues to grow. My main nitpick would be simplistic lyrics and shorter verse sections with repetition but itís alright when the songs are so catchy.



Quite a wide range of deliveries from BF, and they all work
I agree with some verses being too quickly written, repetitive and short
Maybe there's an overall lack of effort, or more probably lack of time as they wrote many songs at Dreamland.

Also think Dalgety is somehow responsible for pushing Charles artistically, which I was unaware of on HC, or maybe he didn't on HC


--
"Aristophanes! (gong sounds)"
"Fucking up my devotion!"

Edited by - sdon on 09/14/2019 23:10:20
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yarbles
= Cult of Ray =

USA
565 Posts

Posted - 09/14/2019 :  23:17:11  Show Profile  Visit yarbles's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage

I gotta tell you, Silver Bullet is really really growing on me. For a 3.5 minute song, it really has an epic vibe and sweep. Like a dusty goth western. Very cinematic (as are many of these songs.)

Also, as I was enjoying this today, and appreciating the production, I couldnít help but reflect yet again on what the mastering did to the last two albums. I think their compressed, sledgehammer, claustrophobic mastering may have really had a subconscious effect on folks that ended up not liking it. The SOUND of those old Pixies albums was a component. BTE still has a heavy handed mastering, but almost everything does today. But itís much much better than the last two. Sparser arrangements help, but if IC and HC had been similarly mastered they may have come across differently, at least to a few folks. IC in particular.

Clearly someone somewhere made a conscious decision to lay off the knob turning down the homestretch this time around. And the album is allowed to breathe and shine for it. I really hope that whoever made this call might consider a remaster of IC and HC where they take a similarly light approach and let the tracks breathe a little. Theyíre so dense that a little headroom might be just what the doctor ordered to help people see them in a new light.


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.



I would absolutely DIE for a heavy remix/remaster of IC and HC... the songs are solid, the presentation is what kills it for me.
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The Maharal
= Cult of Ray =

879 Posts

Posted - 09/14/2019 :  23:27:40  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
If I were to rank these I'd still have the likes of Dog, Golem and Bluefinger ahead. Still haven't come around to the middle of the album - I'm sure some of the demos are better than Long Rider and Los Surfers. The latter is alright, just a bit dull.
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The Maharal
= Cult of Ray =

879 Posts

Posted - 09/14/2019 :  23:29:26  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
And agree with the Bird of Prey appreciation, it's fantastic. Reminds me of You're Gonna Pay. I found it funny BF admitting he used to sing songs in his "I don't care" manner until Tom D told him to up things.
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johnnyribcage
* Dog in the Sand *

USA
1112 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  02:49:35  Show Profile  Visit johnnyribcage's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Just to level-set on the short, repetitive lyrics complaint - Whenís the last time you popped Doolittle on? Thatís one of the most lyrically sparse albums heís done, yet word on the street is that itís a halfway decent album. I think if you go back and actually scan through the lyrics to that album, youíll find that thereís not much to it, and many lyrics definitely come across as completely tossed off, almost incidental. And repetition is the name of the game on many of those tracks.

Tame, in its entirety (with a ton of tameís and uh-huhís repeated):

Got hips like Cinderella
Must be having a good shame
Talking sweet about nothing
Cookie I think you're tame

I'm making good friends with you
When you're shaking your good frame
Fall on your face in those bad shoes
Lying there like you're tame


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.

Edited by - johnnyribcage on 09/15/2019 02:58:12
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johnnyribcage
* Dog in the Sand *

USA
1112 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  02:53:07  Show Profile  Visit johnnyribcage's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by yarbles

quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage

Clearly someone somewhere made a conscious decision to lay off the knob turning down the homestretch this time around. And the album is allowed to breathe and shine for it. I really hope that whoever made this call might consider a remaster of IC and HC where they take a similarly light approach and let the tracks breathe a little. Theyíre so dense that a little headroom might be just what the doctor ordered to help people see them in a new light.


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.



I would absolutely DIE for a heavy remix/remaster of IC and HC... the songs are solid, the presentation is what kills it for me.



Iím actually good with the mixes on these albums - theyíre rich and balanced. IC is dense AF, but itís lush and well mixed. The problem comes in on the mastering side I think. And a remaster is a relatively simple task compared to the monumental task of trying to remix.

We can only hope!!


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.
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Bedbug
* Dog in the Sand *

2422 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  03:04:31  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think Frank is a master of less is more.

One fine day in my odd past.

Not much there, but a whole world of imagination opens up in that song, and many, many others.
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Troubles A Foot
= Cult of Ray =

USA
361 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  06:45:38  Show Profile  Visit Troubles A Foot's Homepage  Reply with Quote
One of my favorite things about Pixies lyrics is how sparse they are.
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johnnyribcage
* Dog in the Sand *

USA
1112 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  07:55:58  Show Profile  Visit johnnyribcage's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Bedbug

I think Frank is a master of less is more.

One fine day in my odd past.

Not much there, but a whole world of imagination opens up in that song, and many, many others.



No doubt - thatís why itís odd that I read a few times already that some folks are thinking there arenít enough lyrics or that theyíre too repetitive. Canít recall who all said it but I saw it referenced a few times up thread.


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.
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tamefan
- FB Fan -

Canada
105 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  08:06:56  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Recipe for a masterpiece

Ingredients
1 x Your mouth's a mile away

Instructions
Repeat for 2 minutes. Mosh intensely.
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picpic
* Dog in the Sand *

Belgium
1791 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  08:13:30  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
It is time
It is time
It is time
For stormy weather

It is time
It is time
It is time
For stormy weather

For stormy weather
For stormy weather
For stormy weather

It is time
It is time
It is time
For stormy weather

It is time
It is time
It is time
For stormy weather

For stormy weather
For stormy weather
For stormy weather
For stormy weather

It is time
It is time
It is time
It is time for stormy weather

It is time
It is time
It is time
It is time for stormy weather

It is time
It is time
It is time
It is time for stormy weather

___
"Service Unavailable"
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johnnyribcage
* Dog in the Sand *

USA
1112 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  08:24:10  Show Profile  Visit johnnyribcage's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by picpic

It is time
It is time
It is time
For stormy weather...
___
"Service Unavailable"



This song is just six words long, this song is just six words long...


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.
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Jeepster
- FB Fan -

USA
123 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  13:35:38  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bossanova has a lot of songs that have very few words. Even an instrumental opener (although I swear I can hear somebody talking very quietly at the end).

-----------------------
Q: Where do Pixies keep their instruments when they're not playing?
A: Debasement.
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johnnyribcage
* Dog in the Sand *

USA
1112 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  13:41:12  Show Profile  Visit johnnyribcage's Homepage  Reply with Quote
So does anyone have the deluxe LP? Mine should be showing up tomorrow. Was wondering what the early verdict was on the 9 additional songs?


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.
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cptnpasty
- FB Fan -

Spain
142 Posts

Posted - 09/15/2019 :  23:46:48  Show Profile  Visit cptnpasty's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage

So does anyone have the deluxe LP? Mine should be showing up tomorrow. Was wondering what the early verdict was on the 9 additional songs?


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.



couldn't afford the deluxe set, but really interested to hear about the demos

www.guillermostitch.com
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Sprite
* Dog in the Sand *

1010 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  00:10:44  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage

So does anyone have the deluxe LP? Mine should be showing up tomorrow. Was wondering what the early verdict was on the 9 additional songs?


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.



I have it but my brand new record player broke. I picked up a new one today and will try again this evening...
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vilainde
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<

Niue
7393 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  01:38:13  Show Profile  Visit vilainde's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I like Death Horizon quite a lot. It's so classic Frank songwriting. I heard a few live versions where the backing vocals were really off-key and it bugged me lot, but they sound awfully nice on the studio version.

I haven't heard the podcast or read anything on this forum prior to buying the album. Does anyone know if it's really Dave drumming on Cain? Sounds like they stole the Jesus & Mary Chain drum machine. I kind of have a problem with Dave's drumming on the recent albums but it sounds great on Cain.

Denis
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Discoking
= Cult of Ray =

Belgium
960 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  01:52:36  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage

So does anyone have the deluxe LP? Mine should be showing up tomorrow. Was wondering what the early verdict was on the 9 additional songs?


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.



Does anyone know what other versions of the record exist?
There's the normal record, on black vinyl, and then the deluxe one, on clear vinyl.

I've seen online that there's a version on white vinyl ("Indies only limited edition white vinyl."): https://www.discogs.com/Pixies-Beneath-The-Eyrie/release/14095957

And the Fnac website mentions a Fnac exclusive (they had exclusive coloured vinyl for the last Pixies records too: orange Indie Cindy and green Head Carrier), but this time it's not explained what the exclusive is exactly.
https://www.fnac.com/a13662884/Pixies-Beneath-The-Eyrie-Exclusivite-Fnac-Vinyle-album
Anybody knows?
(Or would it also be the white vinyl? Maybe Fnac is the only one selling this in France, making it an "exclusive" for Fnac in France?)


it's educational
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vilainde
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<

Niue
7393 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  02:02:56  Show Profile  Visit vilainde's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I went to Fnac on friday but didn't pay much attention to the vinyl. It was either clear or white. Yeah sorry that was useless :)
They had 2 different CD versions though, standard and "deluxe" (no extra tracks)


Denis
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johnnyribcage
* Dog in the Sand *

USA
1112 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  02:27:27  Show Profile  Visit johnnyribcage's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by vilainde

Does anyone know if it's really Dave drumming on Cain? Sounds like they stole the Jesus & Mary Chain drum machine. I kind of have a problem with Dave's drumming on the recent albums but it sounds great on Cain.

Denis



Itís a good question, and I wondered the same thing. Dave is obviously a pro and of course is capable of nailing a tight drum part, but that particular drum track is so metronomic and even, I wonder if there isnít some kind of correction going on. Like an auto tune for tempo / bpm. I donít even know if such a thing exists.

It could be a drum machine, at least on the bass drum. Who knows though. I do know that every time Iíve heard a live version the whole thing sounds very shaky. Itís good, but it sounds like they struggle to maintain that robotic, perfectly in the pocket gallop that they have on the record.

Just last night they posted a performance from the BBC on their Facebook page, and you can here the tempos of the players straining and flexing, as it typically sounds live. Itís really a bear to maintain that kind of robotic precision.

Check out the look on Daveís face right as the song wraps up. I canít tell if itís just relief that they got through it, relief that itís over, exasperation because he wasnít happy with the take, or what. It definitely doesnít appear that he enjoyed playing it! Maybe it was nothing, just a random look. What the hell do I know?


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.

Edited by - johnnyribcage on 09/16/2019 03:22:20
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stuczuba
= Cult of Ray =

416 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  02:52:17  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by vilainde

I haven't heard the podcast or read anything on this forum prior to buying the album. Does anyone know if it's really Dave drumming on Cain? Sounds like they stole the Jesus & Mary Chain drum machine. I kind of have a problem with Dave's drumming on the recent albums but it sounds great on Cain.


He only has to get it right once in the studio and they can loop and patch together whatever the want. I got the impression from the podcast that very few of the tracks are single takes and Dalgety intended to patch together the songs by taking parts from different takes.
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Brank_Flack
= Cult of Ray =

Canada
714 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  02:57:59  Show Profile  Click to see Brank_Flack's MSN Messenger address  Reply with Quote

[/quote]

Does anyone know what other versions of the record exist?
There's the normal record, on black vinyl, and then the deluxe one, on clear vinyl.

I've seen online that there's a version on white vinyl ("Indies only limited edition white vinyl."): https://www.discogs.com/Pixies-Beneath-The-Eyrie/release/14095957

And the Fnac website mentions a Fnac exclusive (they had exclusive coloured vinyl for the last Pixies records too: orange Indie Cindy and green Head Carrier), but this time it's not explained what the exclusive is exactly.
https://www.fnac.com/a13662884/Pixies-Beneath-The-Eyrie-Exclusivite-Fnac-Vinyle-album
Anybody knows?
(Or would it also be the white vinyl? Maybe Fnac is the only one selling this in France, making it an "exclusive" for Fnac in France?)


it's educational
[/quote]

I bought mine from a record shop in Toronto and it's white.
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johnnyribcage
* Dog in the Sand *

USA
1112 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  03:05:39  Show Profile  Visit johnnyribcage's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by stuczuba

quote:
Originally posted by vilainde

.


He only has to get it right once in the studio and they can loop and patch together whatever the want. I got the impression from the podcast that very few of the tracks are single takes and Dalgety intended to patch together the songs by taking parts from different takes.



I thought this as well. You can work a lot of magic with a DAW. One measure of the perfect bass drum and youíve got your loop. Which basically makes it a ďdrum machineĒ at that point for all intents and purposes.


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.
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sdon
= Cult of Ray =

France
764 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  04:10:53  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by vilainde

Does anyone know if it's really Dave drumming on Cain? Sounds like they stole the Jesus & Mary Chain drum machine. I kind of have a problem with Dave's drumming on the recent albums but it sounds great on Cain.




From the live versions, this sure sounds as Dave can drum this, but there are least two of these studio enhancements:
- quantization or ProTools 'Elastic Audio' = this forces the drum beats on the "grid", to get that robotic feel
- triggering : this is probably Dalgety's touch since HC. It means you automatically detect and replace each snare / kick by an optimal sample (or a set of selected samples), thus eliminating some dynamic range and "imperfect" hits, and adding to the drum machine feel
- compression + gate : applied to individual drum tracks. This is what makes the snare and kick on Graveyard Hill for instance so "artificial" (don't breathe)
- I think there is an underlying track of digital drum kit. It may actually be played, as the one used on Bagboy, or programmed.



--
"Aristophanes! (gong sounds)"
"Fucking up my devotion!"

Edited by - sdon on 09/16/2019 04:11:32
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Sprite
* Dog in the Sand *

1010 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  04:11:49  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by jake3

Hope this helps:

Indie Cindy Outtakes:
- Alice Prin
- Banks of the Drain
- Classic Masher [Released on Head Carrier]
- Land of Green [Probably turned into 'Another Toe In the Ocean']
- Last Night the Wolves Came Out
- O' Little Cloud
- Pickerel Picker
- Rats Alive
- Tranquilize Me
- Um Chagga Lagga [Released on Head Carrier]
- Una [Presumably released on Head Carrier as 'Oona']
- Women of War [Released as a bonus track]

Head Carrier Outtakes:
- American Rhyme
- Bogman [Released on Beneath the Eyrie as 'Long Rider']
- Down In Toulon
- I Like To Drive [Released on Beneath the Eyrie as 'Silver Bullet']
- Screw Pine
- Super Lecker

Beneath the Eyrie Outtakes
- Caught In a Dream
- Chapel Hill
- Grow Fins [Captain Beefheart cover]
- Hey, Debussy
- How I Learned To Earn Rewards
- I Just Can't Break It To You
- Los Macheteros
- Mal De Mer
- Mambo Sun [T.Rex cover]
- Please Don't Go
- Sweet Relief [AKA 'Mysterions' & 'Hear Me Out']
- The Good Work of Cyrus
- The Whole of the Law [The Only Ones cover]
- Under the Marigold



By the way before I forget is it possible to get this posted as a sticky entry? It's a brilliant reference.
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Discoking
= Cult of Ray =

Belgium
960 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  04:17:01  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Brank_Flack

I bought mine from a record shop in Toronto and it's white.


ok, cool. thanks!

does it say where it's made?


it's educational
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johnnyribcage
* Dog in the Sand *

USA
1112 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  04:18:18  Show Profile  Visit johnnyribcage's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sdon

quote:
Originally posted by vilainde

Does anyone know if it's really Dave drumming on Cain? Sounds like they stole the Jesus & Mary Chain drum machine. I kind of have a problem with Dave's drumming on the recent albums but it sounds great on Cain.




From the live versions, this sure sounds as Dave can drum this, but there are least two of these studio enhancements:
- quantization or ProTools 'Elastic Audio' = this forces the drum beats on the "grid", to get that robotic feel
- triggering : this is probably Dalgety's touch since HC. It means you automatically detect and replace each snare / kick by an optimal sample (or a set of selected samples), thus eliminating some dynamic range and "imperfect" hits, and adding to the drum machine feel
- compression + gate : applied to individual drum tracks. This is what makes the snare and kick on Graveyard Hill for instance so "artificial" (don't breathe)
- I think there is an underlying track of digital drum kit. It may actually be played, as the one used on Bagboy, or programmed.



--
"Aristophanes! (gong sounds)"
"Fucking up my devotion!"




Excellent insight


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.
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sdon
= Cult of Ray =

France
764 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  04:19:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage

Just to level-set on the short, repetitive lyrics complaint - Whenís the last time you popped Doolittle on? Thatís one of the most lyrically sparse albums heís done, yet word on the street is that itís a halfway decent album. I think if you go back and actually scan through the lyrics to that album, youíll find that thereís not much to it, and many lyrics definitely come across as completely tossed off, almost incidental. And repetition is the name of the game on many of those tracks.

Tame, in its entirety (with a ton of tameís and uh-huhís repeated):

Got hips like Cinderella
Must be having a good shame
Talking sweet about nothing
Cookie I think you're tame

I'm making good friends with you
When you're shaking your good frame
Fall on your face in those bad shoes
Lying there like you're tame


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.



How can such level of creative chaos be compared to anything on HC or BTE?
Zero repetition ŗ la Another Toe or Bel Esprit

It's not a problem of sparse lyrics (BTE has longer lyrics on average than 1.0 albums), but of song structure, that sometimes appears at worst lazy, and at best too academic

Stormy Weather / Rock Music are exceptions, almost like figures of speech / poetic devices



I actually feel like Paz is closer to that mindset or wavelength

--
"Aristophanes! (gong sounds)"
"Fucking up my devotion!"
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moro
- FB Fan -

Italy
192 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  04:46:50  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by vilainde

I went to Fnac on friday but didn't pay much attention to the vinyl. It was either clear or white. Yeah sorry that was useless :)
They had 2 different CD versions though, standard and "deluxe" (no extra tracks)


Denis




Hello, do you know if the standard cd version has a booklet with lyrics inside?
Thanks
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Sprite
* Dog in the Sand *

1010 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  05:02:05  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sdon

quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage

Just to level-set on the short, repetitive lyrics complaint - Whenís the last time you popped Doolittle on? Thatís one of the most lyrically sparse albums heís done, yet word on the street is that itís a halfway decent album. I think if you go back and actually scan through the lyrics to that album, youíll find that thereís not much to it, and many lyrics definitely come across as completely tossed off, almost incidental. And repetition is the name of the game on many of those tracks.

Tame, in its entirety (with a ton of tameís and uh-huhís repeated):

Got hips like Cinderella
Must be having a good shame
Talking sweet about nothing
Cookie I think you're tame

I'm making good friends with you
When you're shaking your good frame
Fall on your face in those bad shoes
Lying there like you're tame


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.



How can such level of creative chaos be compared to anything on HC or BTE?
Zero repetition ŗ la Another Toe or Bel Esprit

It's not a problem of sparse lyrics (BTE has longer lyrics on average than 1.0 albums), but of song structure, that sometimes appears at worst lazy, and at best too academic

Stormy Weather / Rock Music are exceptions, almost like figures of speech / poetic devices



I actually feel like Paz is closer to that mindset or wavelength

--
"Aristophanes! (gong sounds)"
"Fucking up my devotion!"




But you can always find a counter example e.g. There goes my gun or Something against you, genuinely repetetive. If the music is strong enough it can take it. Mind you I usually go to the loo at Pixies gig when Something starts.
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johnnyribcage
* Dog in the Sand *

USA
1112 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  05:43:21  Show Profile  Visit johnnyribcage's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sdon

quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage

Just to level-set on the short, repetitive lyrics complaint...


I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.



How can such level of creative chaos be compared to anything on HC or BTE?
Zero repetition ŗ la Another Toe or Bel Esprit

It's not a problem of sparse lyrics (BTE has longer lyrics on average than 1.0 albums), but of song structure, that sometimes appears at worst lazy, and at best too academic

Stormy Weather / Rock Music are exceptions, almost like figures of speech / poetic devices



I actually feel like Paz is closer to that mindset or wavelength

--
"Aristophanes! (gong sounds)"
"Fucking up my devotion!"




I'll try to answer without sounding like an asshole - it's not my intention - just some friendly discussion about the topic, as these boards are intended to facilitate

So, first off, I didn't start the comparison to 1.0 - It was implied in the argument that the lyrics were lazy, spares, or repetitive in the first place. To say that implies that one thinks they're those things relative to 1.0 Pixies. I assume. If that's wrong, to what are you comparing BTE lyrics to make that claim?

Also, lyrically I didn't think you, me, or anyone else was talking about anything from IC or HC. We're talking about BTE and comparing it to the good old days. So I don't understand the Another Toe or Bel Esprit citation. To be clear, I'm talking about BTE lyrics as they compare to 1.0 work. Not HC or IC. My perception is that the general consensus and theme on this BTE thread is, "hey, something is different (and better) this time around than the last 2 times." So let's put IC and HC aside.

Here was the original line that caught my eye:
"I agree with some verses being too quickly written, repetitive and short. Maybe there's an overall lack of effort, or more probably lack of time as they wrote many songs at Dreamland. "

When I read 'repetitive and short,' that implies sparseness, to me anyway, so that's the word I chose. Sparse basically means few or scant - so a song that consists of a few sentences repeated a few times could be considered as having sparse lyrics. It's semantics to me. Forget that I said 'sparse' for now. I mean 'few and/or repetitive.'

Anyway, if it's not a matter of too few (sparse) lyrics and more about the repetition and presumed laziness (again, I don't really understand the laziness charge), or academic song structure (?), I just have to disagree. If we hold the 1.0 albums up as the gold standard that can never be beaten, then we have to temper our reviews and interpretations of BTE. If we say, "well, it will NEVER be as good as the original albums," from there, you have to say "okay, so how does it compare? Does it come close? Fall far short? etc." I think that's totally fair.

As for repetition, I gather you're using 'repetition' as a descriptor for a basic verse chorus verse song structure, typically with a bridge and a solo, since you referenced Another Toe and Bel Esprit as examples (which have a basic classic pop / rock song structure).

Therefore, if you're talking classic structure, I definitely have to disagree with the assertion that the 1.0 Pixies albums have "zero" examples of this, or that it's an exception. As [I think] we all know, many (not all) Pixies songs from any era exhibit loads of lyrical and/or structural repetition. Maybe there are more these days w/ 2.0, but they've always had these kinds of songs. They aren't a prog band, so I'm not expecting wild deviations from the basic rock formula and typical time signatures. Maybe the manic vocal delivery, youthful energy, or innovative chord structures may give the illusion of something more complex going on. Debasser, Wave of Mutilation, Here Comes Your Man, Monkey, Where Is My Mind etc... all super basic, verse chorus verse songs. There are more but I see no reason to be comprehensive here.

And I guess I have to ask - how do you know there is a lack of effort or time spent on BTE relative to an album like Doolittle or Bossanova? This album seemed to have a pretty long gestation time to me. Also seems like they put quite a significant amount of effort into it. And how does writing in the studio imply a lack of quality or depth is going to be the result? I could be mistaken here, I haven't thought about it for awhile, but didn't Charles write a good bit of Bossanova on the fly during those sessions? Which is why it's so uniform compared to Surfer and Doolittle.

We can certainly agree to disagree. I'm trying to clarify my take on it, and hopefully we aren't talking past one another.



I had a bad reaction to your public hobby writings.

Edited by - johnnyribcage on 09/16/2019 05:56:40
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sdon
= Cult of Ray =

France
764 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  06:48:34  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Got mine today !

--
"Aristophanes! (gong sounds)"
"Fucking up my devotion!"
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marcusb
= Cult of Ray =

USA
308 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  07:06:10  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Is it just me, or do tracks like Catfish Kate and This Is My Fate sound like lost Catholics songs?


-Marcus
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Fitzy
- FB Fan -

Portugal
85 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2019 :  07:12:53  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by moro

quote:
Originally posted by vilainde

I went to Fnac on friday but didn't pay much attention to the vinyl. It was either clear or white. Yeah sorry that was useless :)
They had 2 different CD versions though, standard and "deluxe" (no extra tracks)


Denis




Hello, do you know if the standard cd version has a booklet with lyrics inside?
Thanks



The standard cd version only has the cd. No booklet.
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