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Grotesque
= Cult of Ray =
France
777 Posts |
 Posted - 02/15/2007 : 16:01:37
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quote:
Originally posted by duplicatedman
Is FB too settled and staid to wanna pen anymore poppy-rock anthems?
I hope not.
Barleycorn is very anthem (maybe too much?)
In the time of my ruin is just allright.
But what if an anthem didnt sound at all like an anthem. Like, let's say... Holland Town?
Your appreciation of Frank's career is interesting cos I realise EVERY album seem to have his followers. My own "great depression" was precisely during the begining of the Catholics era, that you enjoyed most. The two album that you point (Black Letter and Devil) were the begining of the better days. It's a neverending topic really. |
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duplicatedman
- FB Fan -
15 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2007 : 16:20:00
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quote:
Phew, I'm alright there then. It's my favourite album. Hi, btw, duplicatedman. Your username is taken from my favourite FB song!
At my wedding I made a mix tape that played during the reception. The 1st song on the mix was All My Ghosts. Seeing the guests all get uncomofortable for the 1st few seconds when he misstarts the song was priceless. The fact that my wife actually approved of the mix tape starting that way was even better.
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Edited by - duplicatedman on 02/15/2007 16:25:42 |
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duplicatedman
- FB Fan -
15 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2007 : 16:28:41
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quote:
Originally posted by coastline
And nice to see someone else long-winded on this forum.
You have no idea how long winded I'm about to get.
I'm already planning my album by album song by song treatise. The fact that FB might read anything I have to say about his music is incredibly motivating for me. You'll be blinded by my walls of text before long. |
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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2007 : 17:02:11
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Give us a dissertation on the lyrics to "All My Ghosts." There's been some great discussion on that song, but I don't think anybody's really pinned it down yet.
 Please pardon me, for these my wrongs. |
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Chris Fabulous
- FB Fan -
45 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2007 : 20:45:17
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quote:
Originally posted by billgoodman
A pro-tools studio version of BLD or SMYT would not work I guess.
I agree. I'm not talking Pro-Tools. I just mean mix the record while not in the same room while the band is playing.
quote:
Originally posted by Grotesque
TMBG "NEW YORK CITY"
Not to be picky, but that song is a cover. It was written by Cub, not TMBG. I can't think of any love songs TMBG have actually written that are that banal. Not even "Another First Kiss."
quote:
Originally posted by duplicatedman
The year he put out Devils Workshop and Black Letter Days really was a huge letdown for me... It was as if Frank lost the ability to self edit...
That's pretty much how I feel about those albums. I mean, there are still more than a few strong tunes, but they're buried under a pile of what boils down to a lot of poorly-recorded bad ideas and missed opportunities. I guess Frank and the band were just caught up in the moment? But then again, a lot of people here love both of those records. If I'm missing something, I don't' know what it is.
CF
www.chrisfabulous.com |
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2007 : 21:22:55
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I embraced the double release, but found BLD and DW lopsided production-wise, BLD as clean and perhaps perceived today as a legitimate bridge between TOTY and FMRM, but DW with tracks as good on substance but muddily produced: not done justice. There was a new TOTY in there somewhere, as would always be the case with FB over any 24 months, if only he could have enough patience for himself. Instead, it would seem he relies upon us, reliably, and with certainty, to find our own. We, and he, could do worse. No criticism of his method meant at all. Frank, do it your way, and trust in us. We'll take the ep's and the boots. It's worked so far.
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tisasawath
= Cult of Ray =
Wallis and Futuna Islands
783 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 01:12:19
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quote:
Originally posted by duplicatedman
The year he put out Devils Workshop and Black Letter Days really was a huge letdown for me. Those albums contained some real clunkers that I couldn't understand. So much of it was downright depressing and none of the kick-ass rockin vibe that I gravitate most to remained. A couple of the songs that attempted to truly rock out had critical flaws that ruined the effort as a whole for me. It was as if Frank lost the ability to self edit and was literally just releasing everything he wrote and recorded without thinking. While that is certainly a cool thought in principle, none of the songs on either album grabbed me in the way his previous songs did. I wished on some levels he had consulted me before releasing them so I could have given him critical feedback, lol (the exact same way I felt about the Stones A bigger Bang mind you so my ego knows no limits) The end result of buying two unsatisfying albums by him at one time was that I actually felt a little ripped off.
I hope you can appreciate the fact that not everyone has exactly your taste and can actually enjoy the work that seems to have blown your expectations. I for one find some of the best from his opus on BLD, and even though TOTY remains my favourite. I enjoy the "kick-ass rockin vibe" as well as some that you would classify as... well, "not kick-ass rockin vibe". It can be great music regardless of the vibe.
Releasing everything - I'm all for it. That way more people get a chance to find something for them.
Treatise writing - I still prefer listening to music than talking or reading about it. I hope the dissertation doesn't veer towards the negative critique, because IMO people are better off if they go do something they like doing (like listen to music they like) than spend their energy wallowing in the negative.
Giving our critical feedback BEFORE the release of an album - heheh, last I heard he still was "noone's dancing bear", which is one of the reasons why I respect an artist.
-----
AAAAWWWWWRRRIIGGHHTTTTT !! ! |
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vilainde
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Niue
7443 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 01:50:06
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I agree 100% with Tisasawath. Gee, this thread is depressing. I wouldn't change a note on BLD.
Denis
"Can you hear me? I aint got shit to say." |
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 03:48:25
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[To anybody who is about to read this, I apologize. I rambled, and thought to edit, and finally I surrendered, which, is to say, I guess I "thought" better to post it as is. Now, where is that drunk/drunken thread? Never can find it when I need it.]
Just to be clear, suspecting I may not have been previously, as if it matters, I think BLD was one of Frank's finest along with FMRM and TOTY. But it must be said that, given the guy has about a dozen, depending on how you slice it, albums, one does feel awkward drawing lines anywhere. It reminds me of choosing my favorite Dostoevsky or Hesse reading, not to embarass anybody, let alone Frank. It may be sick but to me the best of pop rock IS like great literature from the standpoint of how it hits one, or at least how it hits me. I mean, you coulda given Fyodor a thousand years but he wasn't gonna come up with a Speedy Marie or an 85 Weeks. Then again it's beyond ridiculous to compare forms: which is more profound, a circle or a triangle? We can only hope we don't know. Now as to which one I would rather have an honest half hour conversation with, Fyodor or Frank, well, that's a toss up (my actual pick would be Arthur Schopenhauer, but that's another story, but I admit that if I were a scholar I'd have to say Doysoyevsky, but since I'm not I guess I'm a free man.), and, to be on topic, sorta, it's a funny comparison of Frank and Fyodor because if forced into honesty (something I both would and wouldn't wish on any/everybody) I think both could exhibit similarly ambiguous relationships with matters of spirit, whatever that means: FD was a gambling addict who needed a Sonja, and I'm not even gonna get into, not here or even in my own mind, what might be analogous for our man, as if I could. Really. But don't you wanna? I mean, as a fan. That's what fans do, right? (yes, I'm kidding). Yes, I'm done, I think, or at least I think I'm ready for another beer.
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OLDMANOTY
= Cult of Ray =
United Kingdom
469 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 03:58:08
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I didn't actually buy BLD & DW until a couple of years after they came out. I remember listening to 30 second samples on Amazon or something and deciding for the first time to pass, such was my disillusionment. Turns out I was wrong to pass judgement so easily.
BLD was a revelation to me. It was the first Catholics album that I didn't get bored with after a relatively short time. It has a depth and scope that had been missing for me since TOTY, and I seem to discover something new every time I listen to it. 'California Bound' and the title track are my current faves, but it changes all the time.
As for DW, it's slight but fun to listen to and there's not a dull moment - never tire of 'Heloise'.
I still feel that both these albums would have been greater still with more time spent/better production, but there you go. |
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PixieSteve
> Teenager of the Year <
Poland
4698 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 05:01:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
[To anybody who is about to read this, I apologize. I rambled, and thought to edit, and finally I surrendered, which, is to say, I guess I "thought" better to post it as is. Now, where is that drunk/drunken thread? Never can find it when I need it.]
Just to be clear, suspecting I may not have been previously, as if it matters, I think BLD was one of Frank's finest along with FMRM and TOTY. But it must be said that, given the guy has about a dozen, depending on how you slice it, albums, one does feel awkward drawing lines anywhere. It reminds me of choosing my favorite Dostoevsky or Hesse reading, not to embarass anybody, let alone Frank. It may be sick but to me the best of pop rock IS like great literature from the standpoint of how it hits one, or at least how it hits me. I mean, you coulda given Fyodor a thousand years but he wasn't gonna come up with a Speedy Marie or an 85 Weeks. Then again it's beyond ridiculous to compare forms: which is more profound, a circle or a triangle? We can only hope we don't know. Now as to which one I would rather have an honest half hour conversation with, Fyodor or Frank, well, that's a toss up (my actual pick would be Arthur Schopenhauer, but that's another story, but I admit that if I were a scholar I'd have to say Doysoyevsky, but since I'm not I guess I'm a free man.), and, to be on topic, sorta, it's a funny comparison of Frank and Fyodor because if forced into honesty (something I both would and wouldn't wish on any/everybody) I think both could exhibit similarly ambiguous relationships with matters of spirit, whatever that means: FD was a gambling addict who needed a Sonja, and I'm not even gonna get into, not here or even in my own mind, what might be analogous for our man, as if I could. Really. But don't you wanna? I mean, as a fan. That's what fans do, right? (yes, I'm kidding). Yes, I'm done, I think, or at least I think I'm ready for another beer.
what
FAST_MAN RAIDER_MAN - June 19th |
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speedy_m
= Frankofile =
Canada
3581 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 06:23:47
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quote:
Originally posted by PixieSteve
quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
[To anybody who is about to read this, I apologize. I rambled, and thought to edit, and finally I surrendered, which, is to say, I guess I "thought" better to post it as is. Now, where is that drunk/drunken thread? Never can find it when I need it.]
Just to be clear, suspecting I may not have been previously, as if it matters, I think BLD was one of Frank's finest along with FMRM and TOTY. But it must be said that, given the guy has about a dozen, depending on how you slice it, albums, one does feel awkward drawing lines anywhere. It reminds me of choosing my favorite Dostoevsky or Hesse reading, not to embarass anybody, let alone Frank. It may be sick but to me the best of pop rock IS like great literature from the standpoint of how it hits one, or at least how it hits me. I mean, you coulda given Fyodor a thousand years but he wasn't gonna come up with a Speedy Marie or an 85 Weeks. Then again it's beyond ridiculous to compare forms: which is more profound, a circle or a triangle? We can only hope we don't know. Now as to which one I would rather have an honest half hour conversation with, Fyodor or Frank, well, that's a toss up (my actual pick would be Arthur Schopenhauer, but that's another story, but I admit that if I were a scholar I'd have to say Doysoyevsky, but since I'm not I guess I'm a free man.), and, to be on topic, sorta, it's a funny comparison of Frank and Fyodor because if forced into honesty (something I both would and wouldn't wish on any/everybody) I think both could exhibit similarly ambiguous relationships with matters of spirit, whatever that means: FD was a gambling addict who needed a Sonja, and I'm not even gonna get into, not here or even in my own mind, what might be analogous for our man, as if I could. Really. But don't you wanna? I mean, as a fan. That's what fans do, right? (yes, I'm kidding). Yes, I'm done, I think, or at least I think I'm ready for another beer.
what
FAST_MAN RAIDER_MAN - June 19th
These two posts neatly encapsulate the sum contributions to the forum of the respective authors.
maybe I'll kick it
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duplicatedman
- FB Fan -
15 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 07:33:06
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quote:
I hope you can appreciate the fact that not everyone has exactly your taste and can actually enjoy the work that seems to have blown your expectations. I for one find some of the best from his opus on BLD, and even though TOTY remains my favourite. I enjoy the "kick-ass rockin vibe" as well as some that you would classify as... well, "not kick-ass rockin vibe". It can be great music regardless of the vibe.
Releasing everything - I'm all for it. That way more people get a chance to find something for them.
Treatise writing - I still prefer listening to music than talking or reading about it. I hope the dissertation doesn't veer towards the negative critique, because IMO people are better off if they go do something they like doing (like listen to music they like) than spend their energy wallowing in the negative.
Giving our critical feedback BEFORE the release of an album - heheh, last I heard he still was "noone's dancing bear", which is one of the reasons why I respect an artist.
I would never presume to think my opinion is the opinion every must have on a work of art.
The effect music has on a person is always individual and very personal. The fact that this forum is thriving and so active is testament to the reality that FB's later work is finding its audience and that audience is passionate about it.
I come from a creative writing background where workshopping and critiquing one anothers work is a sign of respect and an effort to lend support and ideas. Most critical feedback is positive but some veers in to the negative. The critical process is designed to build one's skill not to make one feel bad. It's also a very subjective process and one's opinion is often the subject of lively debate that in the end makes everyone better for havng participated. Sometimes I worry som of our iconoclastic rock heros don't do enough of that process once they become so establshed that no can offer them any advice. My example of The Stones A Bigger Bang is the best one I can think of where I simply couldn't believe an album that had such great potential went to press with such correctable flaws. It was as if they were surrounded by people who were so awed to be in the studio with them that no one had the perspective or balls to say something.
When I post my thoughts on FB's catalogue of work it will be just one anonymous guy's opinion, take it or leave it. I assure you I am a huge fan and the respect and love I have for FB and most of his work will be apparent. Being a fan does not however mean I love all of his work unconditionally. Heck I can't even say that about my kids, lol. In many cases I will provide my personal perspective on specific songs that missed the mark FOR ME. I will always balance that with what I like and love about other songs (and there will be much of that as well).
I don't profess to know anything about anything either. I probably have no business whatsoever even being on this messageboard and my opinions will ultimately constitute mindless drivel from an anonymous nobody. Such is the beauty of the internet. |
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Grotesque
= Cult of Ray =
France
777 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 07:33:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Chris Fabulous
quote:
Originally posted by Grotesque
TMBG "NEW YORK CITY"
Not to be picky, but that song is a cover. It was written by Cub, not TMBG. I can't think of any love songs TMBG have actually written that are that banal. Not even "Another First Kiss."
I didnt say banal, I like those songs.
Maybe the re-recording on Mink Car is banal. As banal as a Britney Spears B side.
But the original song is both simple and good.
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jackruby
- FB Fan -
USA
71 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 09:35:01
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First of all, I'd like to say that FB.net has, by far, the greatest fan forum that has ever existed. The thoughts and ideas being passed back and forth here are always fun to read and executed in a civil manner It should come as no suprise that the greatest songwriter of all time would have the greatest fan base of all time. I appreciate that everyone has their own unique opinion about the art of Frank Black. He has the ability to apeal to so many people in so many different ways. No two people have ever been effected the same way by his music, although pure awe is always the common denomonator. Without these differences, this site would be rather boring. That said, I can't understand how any FB fan could possibly be let down by BLD!! It is nothing short of pure genius.
I don't like playing the favorites game, but if I did--BLD would have a good chance of winning. To me, saying "this album is good, and this one is not" is like saying "I like chapters 1, 2, and 3 of a particular book, but 4 and 5 disappointed me, and I wish chapters 6-9 were more like the fisrt chapters." How can you pick and choose chapters of a story? Or in Frank's case, as prolific as he is, how can you pick a favorite word from a book? This brings me to the whole point of me writing this...
Someone suggested earlier that Frank has lost the ability to self-edit, and just puts out too much unrefined music.
--HORSE SHIT!!! There is nothing worse than having too little of a great thing (ie-Blind Melon, Tripping Daisy) Frank works his ass off for us, and I say keep it coming!!! The more different directions he goes, the better.
I know he reads this stuff every once in a while, however, I don't know how much stock (if any) he puts into it. But I would be very upset if he became one of those artists who takes 5 years to put out a new album. Life is too short for that.
"Change me Mommy...I pooped my soul." |
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moksha23x
- FB Fan -
USA
245 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 09:41:55
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quote:
Originally posted by jackruby
First of all, I'd like to say that FB.net has, by far, the greatest fan forum that has ever existed. The thoughts and ideas being passed back and forth here are always fun to read and executed in a civil manner It should come as no suprise that the greatest songwriter of all time would have the greatest fan base of all time. I appreciate that everyone has their own unique opinion about the art of Frank Black. He has the ability to apeal to so many people in so many different ways. No two people have ever been effected the same way by his music, although pure awe is always the common denomonator. Without these differences, this site would be rather boring. That said, I can't understand how any FB fan could possibly be let down by BLD!! It is nothing short of pure genius.
I don't like playing the favorites game, but if I did--BLD would have a good chance of winning. To me, saying "this album is good, and this one is not" is like saying "I like chapters 1, 2, and 3 of a particular book, but 4 and 5 disappointed me, and I wish chapters 6-9 were more like the fisrt chapters." How can you pick and choose chapters of a story? Or in Frank's case, as prolific as he is, how can you pick a favorite word from a book? This brings me to the whole point of me writing this...
Someone suggested earlier that Frank has lost the ability to self-edit, and just puts out too much unrefined music.
--HORSE SHIT!!! There is nothing worse than having too little of a great thing (ie-Blind Melon, Tripping Daisy) Frank works his ass off for us, and I say keep it coming!!! The more different directions he goes, the better.
I know he reads this stuff every once in a while, however, I don't know how much stock (if any) he puts into it. But I would be very upset if he became one of those artists who takes 5 years to put out a new album. Life is too short for that.
amen. |
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PixieSteve
> Teenager of the Year <
Poland
4698 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 10:09:16
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quote:
Originally posted by speedy_m
quote:
Originally posted by PixieSteve
quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
[To anybody who is about to read this, I apologize. I rambled, and thought to edit, and finally I surrendered, which, is to say, I guess I "thought" better to post it as is. Now, where is that drunk/drunken thread? Never can find it when I need it.]
Just to be clear, suspecting I may not have been previously, as if it matters, I think BLD was one of Frank's finest along with FMRM and TOTY. But it must be said that, given the guy has about a dozen, depending on how you slice it, albums, one does feel awkward drawing lines anywhere. It reminds me of choosing my favorite Dostoevsky or Hesse reading, not to embarass anybody, let alone Frank. It may be sick but to me the best of pop rock IS like great literature from the standpoint of how it hits one, or at least how it hits me. I mean, you coulda given Fyodor a thousand years but he wasn't gonna come up with a Speedy Marie or an 85 Weeks. Then again it's beyond ridiculous to compare forms: which is more profound, a circle or a triangle? We can only hope we don't know. Now as to which one I would rather have an honest half hour conversation with, Fyodor or Frank, well, that's a toss up (my actual pick would be Arthur Schopenhauer, but that's another story, but I admit that if I were a scholar I'd have to say Doysoyevsky, but since I'm not I guess I'm a free man.), and, to be on topic, sorta, it's a funny comparison of Frank and Fyodor because if forced into honesty (something I both would and wouldn't wish on any/everybody) I think both could exhibit similarly ambiguous relationships with matters of spirit, whatever that means: FD was a gambling addict who needed a Sonja, and I'm not even gonna get into, not here or even in my own mind, what might be analogous for our man, as if I could. Really. But don't you wanna? I mean, as a fan. That's what fans do, right? (yes, I'm kidding). Yes, I'm done, I think, or at least I think I'm ready for another beer.
what
FAST_MAN RAIDER_MAN - June 19th
These two posts neatly encapsulate the sum contributions to the forum of the respective authors.
maybe I'll kick it
lol you do humour too?
FAST_MAN RAIDER_MAN - June 19th |
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moksha23x
- FB Fan -
USA
245 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 10:22:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
[ FD was a gambling addict who needed a Sonja
call me ignorant but what exactly is a "sonja" ??
quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
[ It reminds me of choosing my favorite Dostoevsky or Hesse reading, not to embarass anybody, let alone Frank.
Are you presuming that people will be embarrassed by your "intellectually complex" references to Dostoevsky, Hesse, and Schopenhauer. Was it supposed to be all that complex?....you dropped a couple names and tried to figure out who you'd like to meet. You also stated that Frank and Fyodor could both exhibit ambiguous relationships with matters of spirit....FD is "gambling addict who needed a sonja".........what is Frank's similar ambiguity ??? oh yeah you didn't want to get into it..........I guess that was complex, I'm confused.....What the fu%* is a "Sonja" ? ......"Stupid Me"
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Edited by - moksha23x on 02/16/2007 10:47:57 |
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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 11:05:45
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Now who's drunk?
Please pardon me, for these my wrongs. |
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speedy_m
= Frankofile =
Canada
3581 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 11:27:31
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quote:
Originally posted by PixieSteve
quote:
Originally posted by speedy_m
quote:
Originally posted by PixieSteve
quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
[To anybody who is about to read this, I apologize. I rambled, and thought to edit, and finally I surrendered, which, is to say, I guess I "thought" better to post it as is. Now, where is that drunk/drunken thread? Never can find it when I need it.]
Just to be clear, suspecting I may not have been previously, as if it matters, I think BLD was one of Frank's finest along with FMRM and TOTY. But it must be said that, given the guy has about a dozen, depending on how you slice it, albums, one does feel awkward drawing lines anywhere. It reminds me of choosing my favorite Dostoevsky or Hesse reading, not to embarass anybody, let alone Frank. It may be sick but to me the best of pop rock IS like great literature from the standpoint of how it hits one, or at least how it hits me. I mean, you coulda given Fyodor a thousand years but he wasn't gonna come up with a Speedy Marie or an 85 Weeks. Then again it's beyond ridiculous to compare forms: which is more profound, a circle or a triangle? We can only hope we don't know. Now as to which one I would rather have an honest half hour conversation with, Fyodor or Frank, well, that's a toss up (my actual pick would be Arthur Schopenhauer, but that's another story, but I admit that if I were a scholar I'd have to say Doysoyevsky, but since I'm not I guess I'm a free man.), and, to be on topic, sorta, it's a funny comparison of Frank and Fyodor because if forced into honesty (something I both would and wouldn't wish on any/everybody) I think both could exhibit similarly ambiguous relationships with matters of spirit, whatever that means: FD was a gambling addict who needed a Sonja, and I'm not even gonna get into, not here or even in my own mind, what might be analogous for our man, as if I could. Really. But don't you wanna? I mean, as a fan. That's what fans do, right? (yes, I'm kidding). Yes, I'm done, I think, or at least I think I'm ready for another beer.
what
FAST_MAN RAIDER_MAN - June 19th
These two posts neatly encapsulate the sum contributions to the forum of the respective authors.
maybe I'll kick it
lol you do humour too?
FAST_MAN RAIDER_MAN - June 19th
Hey, when does FMRM come out?
maybe I'll kick it
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 11:46:42
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In Dostoevsky's "Crime and Punishment" it is Sonja's peasant piety that "saves" the intellectually overwrought Raskolnikov, if memory serves. Need to read that book again. When I re-read it at age forty I found so much in it that I felt that I had had no business first reading it at age twenty.
The reference to embarassment was intended only to get at the embarassment some artists might feel at having their accomplishments ranked. Now that I'm awake and suffering the super-sobriety of a hangover, I doubt Frank would be embarassed by that at all. After all, he reads here and has seen how we rank everything.
I guess I was namedropping, and pretending to the "intellectually complex". Mostly I was on a solitary, online drunken roll, and then when I actually saw what I had written I felt it was too whatever it was not to post. I don't know what Frank's spiritual ambiguity might consist of, partially because it is in the nature of ambiguity to be indecipherable. Frank obviously has a relationship with both matters of the spirit and with those of flesh and blood, and sometimes when we’re drunk the two don’t seem as far apart as they usually do. That post is not worth much analysis. “Stupid Me” is a good point of reference.
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moksha23x
- FB Fan -
USA
245 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 11:58:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
In Dostoevsky's "Crime and Punishment" it is Sonja's peasant piety that "saves" the intellectually overwrought Raskolnikov, if memory serves. Need to read that book again. When I re-read it at age forty I found so much in it that I felt that I had had no business first reading it at age twenty.
The reference to embarassment was intended only to get at the embarassment some artists might feel at having their accomplishments ranked. Now that I'm awake and suffering the super-sobriety of a hangover, I doubt Frank would be embarassed by that at all. After all, he reads here and has seen how we rank everything.
I guess I was namedropping, and pretending to the "intellectually complex". Mostly I was on a solitary, online drunken roll, and then when I actually saw what I had written I felt it was too whatever it was not to post. I don't know what Frank's spiritual ambiguity might consist of, partially because it is in the nature of ambiguity to be indecipherable. Frank obviously has a relationship with both matters of the spirit and with those of flesh and blood, and sometimes when we’re drunk the two don’t seem as far apart as they usually do. That post is not worth much analysis. “Stupid Me” is a good point of reference.
Thnaks for the Sonja definition...........the post is clearer to me now
For the hangover: Burnt toast?....Bloody Mary?
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Edited by - moksha23x on 02/16/2007 11:59:56 |
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Jefrey
= Cult of Ray =
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 12:37:16
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I can't get into BLD or DW for the reasons many people have pointed out - the production. I think the songs are fine, but the music to me just doesn't pop - it sounds muddy and flat. I keep wanting to give them another chance since so many forum members rank them among their faves, but I don't seem to get around to it.
That said, I would MUCH rather have Frank Black or Robert Pollard continue to be prolific and take chances and realease tons of music and let us decide whether we like it or not.
It's much less of a dissapoiment to have a FB album come out that isn't your favorite knowing that something new is coming just around the corner that just may blow your socks off!
I used to be a Weezer fan. Then they took lke 3 years to record their final album, which ended up being one of the worst pieces of shit ever created. There was this huge buildup of how they were taking their time to refine and practice and narrow down a selection of like 30 songs. It was rerecorded at least once because they wanted it to kick ass. It didn't. It was horrible. I don't think I've listened to a Weezer song since, and I used to really like them.
Anyway, I'd much rather have a couple FB album I only kind of like and get something new once a year or more than wait 3 years for something really disappointing.
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jeffamerica
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 14:08:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Jefrey
I used to be a Weezer fan. Then they took lke 3 years to record their final album, which ended up being one of the worst pieces of shit ever created. There was this huge buildup of how they were taking their time to refine and practice and narrow down a selection of like 30 songs. It was rerecorded at least once because they wanted it to kick ass. It didn't. It was horrible. I don't think I've listened to a Weezer song since, and I used to really like them.
Funny that you should mention Weezer because last night I was thinking of Rivers Cuomo vs. James Mercer (the Shins), along the lines of our "songwriters as good as Frank" topic, as I was listening to a Shins boot. I was thinking of how Cuomo is apparently done, though it still could turn out that he has spent the last ten years in a pot haze from which he will emerge to shine again, whereas with Mercer the future remains open. He is a guy who could produce a decades-long catalog of great pop rock. The first time I listened to the most recent Shins disc I was disappointed, finding it flat and derivative, but then in the last week I received the single/ep for the album, popped it in, and heard it as truly worthy of the first two Shins discs. That prompted me to give the new Shins disc another chance and it sounded wonderful.
By the way, the Shins boot I was listening to is from Aug 23, 2006, in NYC. I like the Shins a lot, but it has seemed to me that they don't boot particularly well. That said, the boot I listened to last night is probably the best one I've heard. It starts out awkwardly, as the band hasn't yet settled into the gig, and the audience recorder takes a while to get his set-up right, but the last two thirds of the recording and performance capture the magic. A couple tracks from the new disc are previewed. It's still available for download here: http://www.dimeadozen.org/torrents-details.php?id=109806
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2007 : 18:04:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Grotesque
All right, Violet is absolutly NOT a simple and cute little song. It contains a cryptic magic formula that drives crazy all the forum members of the world.
heheheh |
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Ronwell Quincy Dobbs
- FB Fan -
USA
16 Posts |
Posted - 02/19/2007 : 20:43:43
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Does anyone skip 'My Life is in Storage' after 1:58? This sums it all up for me.
I can't wait till 1:59 hits. I think HONEYCOMB is a masterpiece and FASTMAN RAIDERMAN is a slightly indulgent masterpiece. I think FB has been on a roll since DOG IN THE SAND.
It's crack. It's great. It gets you really high. |
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Jefrey
= Cult of Ray =
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 02/19/2007 : 22:25:07
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Hey, well I listen to 1826 over and over, so you won't see me skipping any of "my life is in storage" :)
Although I do admit to making my own "short" versions of FMRM. And the White Album.
This is one of the great things about the digital age. My version of Honeycomb cuts a few tracks from the official release and adds back a few of the ones from the leaked demo version, so I get my own custom made album that makes me happiest.
I don't kow what the artist would think of this. I guess if it were my album I wouldn't care much if someone wanted to resequence it or modify it to their own tastes as long as they were listening and enjoying it.
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jeffamerica
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Grotesque
= Cult of Ray =
France
777 Posts |
Posted - 02/20/2007 : 06:53:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Jefrey
[br
Although I do admit to making my own "short" versions of FMRM. And the White Album.
Here's my short FMRM. Respect to the full lenght version, this takes me higher AND i listen all of it.
1 In the Time of My Ruin
2 Wanderlust
3 Holland Town
4 It’s Just Not Your Moment
5 Fare Thee Well
6 Where the Wind Is Going
7 Fitzgerald
8 Raider Man
10 Seven Days
11 Elijah
12 I'm Not Dead (I'm In Pittsburgh)
13 Down to You
14 Don’t Cry That Way
15 Johnny Barleycorn
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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
Posted - 02/20/2007 : 08:57:26
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That's a nice mix, Grotesque. I'm going to make a playlist tonight and try it out. This past weekend, I tried again to get into that album, and just couldn't do it. Some of the songs just bore me. I'll try the Grotesque-edited version now.
Please pardon me, for these my wrongs. |
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Ziggy
* Dog in the Sand *
United Kingdom
2463 Posts |
Posted - 02/20/2007 : 10:03:09
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| That's a brilliant edit, Grotesque. I don't care much for 'Down to You', but I could happily to listen to that mix. |
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Grotesque
= Cult of Ray =
France
777 Posts |
Posted - 02/20/2007 : 11:28:52
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| Wait! The 9 has vanished. It was Fast Man! |
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coastline
> Teenager of the Year <
USA
3111 Posts |
Posted - 02/20/2007 : 11:43:45
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Even better. I love that song. I listened to it Sunday as we drove through Cheyenne (which is what prompted me to try to listen to the whole album again).
Please pardon me, for these my wrongs. |
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Steak n Sabre
* Dog in the Sand *
Uzbekistan
1013 Posts |
Posted - 02/20/2007 : 22:23:03
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The mix on Devil's Workshop sounds fine to me. What's the comparison anyway? No reason why everything should sound the same really....
 What?... Me Worry???  |
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vilainde
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Niue
7443 Posts |
Posted - 02/20/2007 : 23:59:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Grotesque
Here's my short FMRM. Respect to the full lenght version, this takes me higher AND i listen all of it.
1 In the Time of My Ruin
2 Wanderlust
3 Holland Town
4 It’s Just Not Your Moment
5 Fare Thee Well
6 Where the Wind Is Going
7 Fitzgerald
8 Raider Man
10 Seven Days
11 Elijah
12 I'm Not Dead (I'm In Pittsburgh)
13 Down to You
14 Don’t Cry That Way
15 Johnny Barleycorn
Funny... Holland Town, Where The Wind, 7 Days and Down To You are out of my own version. The Real El Rey and Dog Sleep should definitely be in there somewhere. I don't know how anyone can live without The Real El Rey.
Denis
"Can you hear me? I aint got shit to say." |
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Jefrey
= Cult of Ray =
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2007 : 00:03:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Steak n Sabre
The mix on Devil's Workshop sounds fine to me. What's the comparison anyway? No reason why everything should sound the same really....
What?... Me Worry???
I guess I compare to FB&TC's and Pistolero, which were also recorded "live" but sound more vibrant and energetic to me.
DW, every time I listen to it makes me remember some of the Catholics shows where they looked utterly bored on stage and were just grinding out a paycheck.
I know it's a business and shows are hit and miss (luckily for me 95% of the FB shos I've attended have been fantastic), but that's just what DW reminds me of. That one or 2 bad shows.
I'm really glad that so many people do like it though. More Frank for you!
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jeffamerica
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I'm new here, love Frank, but....
