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freedom rocker
- FB Fan -
USA
88 Posts |
 Posted - 11/24/2002 : 17:42:34
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I pretty much wrote the heading "Frank Black Sucks" to draw attention, and to summarize what my brother tells me all the time.
He's pretty much into bands like the bosstones and lincoln park.
I have noticed one thing though, even though frank black is my favorite solo artist he contradicts himself all the time. He's kind of made it an unofficial goal to shun the mainstream music scene, and I can totally understand that. Once anyone can label you (especially musical critics or journalists) you become theirs - at their disposal. Once you have a label you become a product. That's why I can see why frank shuns them and also why he's constantly changing.
What I don't understand is why Frank complains about his standing on the musical scene. He is because he has chosen to be. He says that most people don't have good taste's (there was a quote, but I don't remember word for word) It may be true that peoples taste's suck, but then you get down to questions like "what is music?, what determines good music?, and has what we have considered music in the past 50 years really just mass-marketed junk suited for the teenagers of each generation?.
I'm so confused. |
Edited by - freedom rocker on 11/24/2002 17:50:41 |
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Chip Away Boy
= Cult of Ray =
914 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2002 : 17:50:14
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I would argue that Mr. Thompson does not go out of his way to make music that isn't mainstream, rather that his constant musical evolution is just due to the fact that some people often change the style of music that they want to play, and it just so happens that these styles are NOT popular in mainstream.
just my thoughts.. |
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freedom rocker
- FB Fan -
USA
88 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2002 : 17:53:31
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| I understand that, but I just sense a tinge of jealousy from frank, even though he doesn't out-right say it. |
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Visiting Sasquatch
= Cult of Ray =
USA
451 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2002 : 19:40:04
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| Your brother has bad taste, and that's why Frank Black isn't mainstream. And I bet Frank would welcome more listeners if given the choice, but the reality is, he isn't mainstream. And I agree with Frank when he says mainstream music sucks. It really does. |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2002 : 20:56:58
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i think Frank has accepted certain things about his place in the the music industry because so much of it is out of his control..
but that doesn't mean he can't still complain about it and occasionally get pissed off at how lame it is. which it is.
the music industry is not set up to recognize diverse talents..
it's like David Bowie said on Carson Daly the other night, refering to Frank and The Pixies: they never really got a chance. There is good music being produced right now, but it doesn't get a chance because mainstream musical tastes are caught in this self-perpetuating shit cycle. and everything is so corporate-dominated that only true music lovers get the good stuff, because they're the ones willing to make an effort and find stuff. most listeners are just lazy and don't mind having total ASS shoved down their throats. because they don't know any better.
would Beck be as big as he is if Loser hadn't become the runaway hit that it did? Before that, he was just playing little gigs in Silverlake and Los Feliz, and probably would have continued on a relatively small-scale if he hadn't had that hit.
in a way though, hasn't that always been the case? the same thing goes for movies.. most Hollywood movies are total formulaic shlock.. but occasionally something cool will slip through the cracks.. that is both financially successful AND cool.. but usually you have to go to the art house theatre to find the less conventional stuff.
the same goes for music i think..
we should just be happy that we're among the enlightened.
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Edited by - floop on 11/24/2002 21:17:47 |
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freedom rocker
- FB Fan -
USA
88 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2002 : 21:02:39
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amen
the blues isn't an art-form, it's a product not unlike computer chips and tampons. |
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El Barto
= Song DB Master =
USA
4020 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2002 : 23:01:57
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Entertainment, be it music, movies, whatever, is all about the money these days. It's about how many CDs this artist will sell or how many of his fans will pay $25 to see the show. It's disgusting, it is the music industry.
As to opinions in music, what defines good music, who's right and who's wrong, etc...It is ultimately an opinion, but there really is good taste and bad taste, I think. It's insulting to me when a casual listener (you know, the general category people are in by default...those who listen to music if it's there, who turn on the radio when they're in the car, who might buy CDs, etc.) calls something crappy. Now, if someone with good music taste (musician, large music collection, music historian [someone who knows a good bit about the history of music and how it has evolved and how one form influnces another], etc.) calls it crappy, then I might understand. There's just honestly people out there who know enough about music to have good taste and know bands like Puddle of Mudd and the likes are just mainstream radio bullshit and are there to make money. I am confident in that, just as much as I am to say that anyone in their right mind with a good head on their shoulder would think the current administration in the white house is terrible. But that's another post...
www.thebennies.com |
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mdisanto
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1140 Posts |
Posted - 11/25/2002 : 03:23:39
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quote:
and everything is so corporate-dominated that only true music lovers get the good stuff, because they're the ones willing to make an effort and find stuff. most listeners are just lazy and don't mind having total ASS shoved down their throats. because they don't know any better.
becuase that statement is true, all the crap that goes on doesnt really matter, becuase we still get the music anyway. franks getting food on the table, we hear his songs, i can live with that
-miked |
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Little Black Francis
> Teenager of the Year <
3648 Posts |
Posted - 11/25/2002 : 04:08:04
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| word floop |
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KingOfSiam
- FB LinkMaster -
USA
460 Posts |
Posted - 11/25/2002 : 07:09:53
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self-perpetuating shit cycle - excellent discription of todays Top 40!
I agree with all I've read but... I am not certain Frank wants to broaden his listener base. As a marketing guru, I wonder why Frank doesn't sell merch at the last few shows that I have been to. If one of his fans (i.e. "us") bought a shirt and wore it (which I know each and everyone of us would)that is advertising for Frank. Not only is it advertising but it is advertising that someone paid him for as well as INCOME!!! If one person saw a Frank Black Tshirt and buried the name Frank Black deep in their subconcious and many moons later that same person was at the CD store looking for a new album and Frank Black pops into his head and he buys a CD (a Frank Black CD) I just don't understand how a business (and it is a business) can operate like that. If Frank wanted to be bigger, larger or more popular than he is now - he could be. I personally, do not want him to (I like to be able to get to a show 30 minutes prior and get a good spot)Music is a business and Frank Black and The Catholics, yes, is a business. And like any business, with proper management, advertising etc. - the business can grow! |
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Bartholomew
= Cult of Ray =
USA
344 Posts |
Posted - 11/26/2002 : 06:08:32
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How ironic this topic was started by someone called ÒFreedom RockÓ. Being commercialy popular has nothing to do with being good or bad (the Big Man himself likes Neil Young and the Doors). Truth is most indie bands (and movies) suck. It is too bad however how successful the powers that be are at pushing what they want to sell and how robotic the general public acts in accepting it, not giving incredible stuff like Frank Black a chance to be more widely heard. My guess is if people were exposed to Frank and told by the mainstream that it was "cool" like they're told with The White Stripes and The Strokes, he would be a top seller. Basically, they'd like it if they had a chance to hear it, but let's face it, you've really got to be an Encyclopedia Brown (as we all are here) to discover Frank.
I think what's most important to remember is: Nobody owns the pleasure of tones, that belongs to a guy with no ear. |
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GiJoewithKungFuGrip
- FB Fan -
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 11/26/2002 : 06:17:52
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Face it, Frank Black has inspired more artists than we can count. He revolutionized music in the 80's and continues to do so to this day. This guy loads and unloads his own gear. He obviously is about more than "Mainstream" music and ultimately has a quest for self satisfaction in regards to the way he lives his life. Many have and will continue to " Compromise" in order to hear 60,0000 fans in a stadium. I to this day and stunned that "Aerosmith" is still around???
L8
"I'll have the cheese and eggs, scrambled,with plain toast,grits,bacon and hashbrowns scattered and covered." |
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bazza
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1439 Posts |
Posted - 11/26/2002 : 11:06:38
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to be honest i would rather sit in an intimate venue to listen to FB than be 50 feckin rows back thinking i can see him. agreed?
cheers lads
cartoons kick ass.
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frank_black_francis
= Cult of Ray =
Canada
895 Posts |
Posted - 11/26/2002 : 18:16:39
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im with bazza.......i wouldnt be able to stand seeing fb&c's in anything that holds more than 1000 spectators....i avoid going to large venues even when its bands i like....the sound sucks and the musicians take on a very impersonal tone with the crowd......as long as frank black is on the road though, they will come.....hopefully not by the thousands though
wutchu talkin bout willis? |
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Itchload
= Cult of Ray =
USA
891 Posts |
Posted - 11/28/2002 : 21:55:46
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| Yeah, this touches on something I've noticed. Some Frank Black fans get a little too heroic in their ways of describing Frank. "Frank would hate to be famous because popular music sucks and Frank would never want to sell tons of records and every famous band is terrible" While there's some truth in those grievences obviously, I think Frank would not object to suddenly have his albums flyin' off the shelves. He talks often about how it's always good to have your name in the paper, good or bad. I highly doubt he'd want to become a super star, but if all his albums sold like Doolittle I doubt our man would object. |
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zanni67
= Bio Elf =
643 Posts |
Posted - 11/29/2002 : 04:48:12
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Lots of good thoughts here, and I agreee I enjoy the smaller venues and more 'personalized' feel of the shows due to the smaller audience. It's also cool to be able to go to something like an in-store and see Frank really up close and personal. That is something that prolly would not occur if they were a more commercialized band. I also agree about the business aspect. As someone who owns her own business, I can say it is true you can be as big as you want to be. It all depends on how you drive it.
Zan
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