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Brank_Flack
* Dog in the Sand *
Canada
1059 Posts |
 Posted - 12/12/2024 : 08:52:08
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Yeah, I'm on the more-is-more side with Frank. He's an intuitive snake feeling his way rather than an painstaking architect of a grand vision. He writes in batches for studio sessions, and admits himself that he's not great at quality control in the moment. So, his songwriting style does not lend itself towards accumulating gems over a few years in order to release a great mission statement. The more albums we get means the more gems he writes, less pressure on each album to be a mission statement, and more room for experimentation and even interesting misfires, even at the expense of a few duds.
(This is in part why I think the comparison with Kim Deal's new album in the other thread was an apples for oranges comparison, as this is decidedly not how Kim works.) |
Edited by - Brank_Flack on 12/12/2024 08:53:16 |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6256 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2024 : 13:05:50
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Kim works slow
One of the reasons she fell out with Robert Pollard
You can't compare Kim and Frank at all.
Funnily enough, both Frank and Kim have a thing for country and analog recording.
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BF: Mag ik Engels spreken? |
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Troubles A Foot
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1029 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2024 : 18:44:34
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quote:
Originally posted by billgoodman
Kim works slow
One of the reasons she fell out with Robert Pollard
You can't compare Kim and Frank at all.
I'm not sure I understand why you can't compare them. You can compare albums of any artist with other artists, right? And they're both in the indie/alternative rock genre and come from the same band. Of course they're comparable. And Kim put out a new album and Pixies put out a new album and I think Kim's is of far greater quality. I can compare Kim's album with other artists who put out new albums too in the past year. What does the speed at which they work have to do with that? You can compare movies from different directors that work at different speeds too. |
Edited by - Troubles A Foot on 12/12/2024 20:38:17 |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6256 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2024 : 23:48:06
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Sorry, I mean more in a general sense
Of course albums to albums is more than fine
But I never understood the whole Beatles vs Stones thing too
Kim and Frank are totally different giants
Frank is more is more (cause he can go every way, both good and bad)
Kim is less is more (cause she basically does the same thing over and over)
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BF: Mag ik Engels spreken? |
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Mad Lucas
- FB Fan -
Australia
186 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 02:56:00
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The issue in evaluating an artist by their entire history of work, then comparing that artist to another and their work, is that we make assumptions regarding what makes the music 'good', both on its own terms and according to our personal understanding of 'good', which we never exactly share with another person.
I've had this conversation with Trouble in another topic but I personally find the Pixies album to be better than Kim's recent work. I don't think she is the same calibre of artist and doesn't have the songwriting chops. Nonetheless, on her own terms, as an artist that prioritises aesthetic, mood, attitude, and as one who seems to always be chasing the same sound, I can appreciate and enjoy the album, though when set against her other work there is a point of diminishing returns. It's a bit like Dinosaur Jr. When you've written the same song seven times there's a lessening of impact.
My opinion is grounded in prioritising songcraft, engagement with or response to music tradition, hearing an artist evolve, among other things. Frank/Black/Charles hits that spot for me. |
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Skatealex1
* Dog in the Sand *
1701 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 05:43:50
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I guess it may be subjective to some degrees but almost every song on Kim's new album is more interesting and fun to me than the new Pixies album.
I also feel like FB's songwriting hasn't exactly improved in recent years compared to his best stuff. At least the lyrics improved since Doggerel but on that album stuff like "There's a Moon on" and "I went to 711 and I think it's really great" felt like amateur hour from what I expect from Frank (no offense to the man).
From Kim's album- Crystal Breath, Are You Mine, Big Ben Beat, A Good Time Pushed are all more exciting/relistinable than just about any song from the last two Pixies album for me. |
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Brank_Flack
* Dog in the Sand *
Canada
1059 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 06:30:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Mad Lucas
I've had this conversation with Trouble in another topic but I personally find the Pixies album to be better than Kim's recent work. I don't think she is the same calibre of artist and doesn't have the songwriting chops. Nonetheless, on her own terms, as an artist that prioritises aesthetic, mood, attitude, and as one who seems to always be chasing the same sound, I can appreciate and enjoy the album, though when set against her other work there is a point of diminishing returns. [...]
My opinion is grounded in prioritising songcraft, engagement with or response to music tradition, hearing an artist evolve, among other things. Frank/Black/Charles hits that spot for me.
I agree with this. I think Kim has immaculate aesthetic taste and a knack for arrangements, but Frank's songwriting is just more idiosyncratic and interesting to me. Nobody Loves You More is a pleasant listen, but it veers a bit too close to well-produced-indie-music-by-the-numbers. I'll take Primrose, Jane, Mercy Me, Motoroller, Kings of the Prairie over most of NLYM, whereas The Night the Zombies Came came together in weeks or months as opposed to a decade. |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 06:52:52
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Related I think to this topic:
Was it that Kim had a real sense of how amazing 1.0 was and didn't want to tarnish the legacy like so many sequels do, etc?
Seems like Frank had a phase of that ("beautiful corpse") but also at the same time was demythologizing his own legacy in real time and loving it.
Also, Kim works at her pace (slower than Frank), and produces a certain number of songs (fewer than Frank) that hit on different levels (good songs bad songs) and Frank works at his pace (faster than Kim) and produces a certain number of songs (more than Kim) that hit on different levels (good songs bad songs).
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Troubles A Foot
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1029 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 08:16:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Brank_Flack
Nobody Loves You More is a pleasant listen, but it veers a bit too close to well-produced-indie-music-by-the-numbers. I'll take Primrose, Jane, Mercy Me, Motoroller, Kings of the Prairie over most of NLYM, whereas The Night the Zombies Came came together in weeks or months as opposed to a decade.
I just feel the total opposite. Nobody Loves You More isn't "pleasant" to me, it has multiple songs that moved me to tears. Nothing Frank has done has come close to that in a long time (maybe the bridge for Daniel Boone, and of course I love the reject songs from Eyrie. I also love the new solo song "The Liar" which is very moving.) I don't hear anything by the numbers in Kim's new album, each song is totally different, with different production styles and different songwriting techniques.
But also the production is so much better than the Pixies album it is insane. It's just so much more enjoyable to listen to because I don't get distracted by how bad the vocals or drums sound. And none of the songs sound like Kim is forcing anything. All of the new Pixies sounds like Frank is forcing solo songs into a Pixies shape and I know I've said this 1,000 times here, but I just can't get over how awkward that can be. They are a solid band but for some of these songs it doesn't feel like they are the right people.
I genuinely think the Pixies maybe should have "died" and he should have just been a solo artist. I think we'd all see more freedom from him in the songwriting, who he chooses to play on his albums, etc. We'd have more range of stuff like Honeycomb to Teenager of the Year to Bluefinger, etc. I find the Pixies thing kind of restraining for him, but the financial incentives are too great so he stays with it. I think he is indeed "caught in a dream" that he can't get out of. Part of why seeing him play solo was so incredibly refreshing last week.
Anyway this is all to say that Kim's new album just feels so real and inspired to me and the Pixies new album feels awkward to me. |
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Skatealex1
* Dog in the Sand *
1701 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 08:31:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Troubles A Foot
But also the production is so much better than the Pixies album it is insane. It's just so much more enjoyable to listen to because I don't get distracted by how bad the vocals or drums sound. And none of the songs sound like Kim is forcing anything. All of the new Pixies sounds like Frank is forcing solo songs into a Pixies shape and I know I've said this 1,000 times here, but I just can't get over how awkward that can be. They are a solid band but for some of these songs it doesn't feel like they are the right people.
I genuinely think the Pixies maybe should have "died" and he should have just been a solo artist. I think we'd all see more freedom from him in the songwriting, who he chooses to play on his albums, etc. We'd have more range of stuff like Honeycomb to Teenager of the Year to Bluefinger, etc. I find the Pixies thing kind of restraining for him, but the financial incentives are too great so he stays with it. I think he is indeed "caught in a dream" that he can't get out of. Part of why seeing him play solo was so incredibly refreshing last week.
I agree with pretty much of all of this. I don't hate on someone for cashing in but Frank doesn't even hide that Pixies is in big part a cash cow. I appreciate that hea evolved it to not try to recreate the old Pixies sound but it still seems almost a little off in some ways. Like letting Tom Dalgety seemingly make a lot of big choices like tracklists apparently and coming from a more classic rock than indie rock background. (Since when are Pixies a classic rock influenced band)
The Kim Deal production is so much more enjoyable and natural sounding to me than maybe any Pixies 2.0 release I can think of.
I'd add the last Breeders album on this list too. Even if it maybe sticks to Kim's guns a bit- it still just sounds more natural sounding and not overproduced indie rock where as maybe every Pixies 2.0 album has weird production choices that take away from it. |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 08:35:51
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I don’t know if anything 1.0 has moved me to tears, other than tears of “this is amazing”
Maybe Motorway if I step into it
Nothing Kim has done gets me emotionally either, but always enjoy the listen |
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Brank_Flack
* Dog in the Sand *
Canada
1059 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 08:44:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Troubles A Foot
quote:
Originally posted by Brank_Flack
Nobody Loves You More is a pleasant listen, but it veers a bit too close to well-produced-indie-music-by-the-numbers. I'll take Primrose, Jane, Mercy Me, Motoroller, Kings of the Prairie over most of NLYM, whereas The Night the Zombies Came came together in weeks or months as opposed to a decade.
I just feel the total opposite. Nobody Loves You More isn't "pleasant" to me, it has multiple songs that moved me to tears. Nothing Frank has done has come close to that in a long time (maybe the bridge for Daniel Boone, and of course I love the reject songs from Eyrie. I also love the new solo song "The Liar" which is very moving.) I don't hear anything by the numbers in Kim's new album, each song is totally different, with different production styles and different songwriting techniques.
But also the production is so much better than the Pixies album it is insane. It's just so much more enjoyable to listen to because I don't get distracted by how bad the vocals or drums sound. And none of the songs sound like Kim is forcing anything. All of the new Pixies sounds like Frank is forcing solo songs into a Pixies shape and I know I've said this 1,000 times here, but I just can't get over how awkward that can be. They are a solid band but for some of these songs it doesn't feel like they are the right people.
I genuinely think the Pixies maybe should have "died" and he should have just been a solo artist. I think we'd all see more freedom from him in the songwriting, who he chooses to play on his albums, etc. We'd have more range of stuff like Honeycomb to Teenager of the Year to Bluefinger, etc. I find the Pixies thing kind of restraining for him, but the financial incentives are too great so he stays with it. I think he is indeed "caught in a dream" that he can't get out of. Part of why seeing him play solo was so incredibly refreshing last week.
Anyway this is all to say that Kim's new album just feels so real and inspired to me and the Pixies new album feels awkward to me.
Yeah, it's inarguable that the production (and arrangements) on Kim's album is better, but I don't have the same emotional connection to the songs that you do.
I also agree that there is something awkward to Pixies 2.0 baked into the core - but I also think that despite some duds, the tension between Frank's mature songwriting style and the band creates some interesting, and again, idiosyncratic results that I am overall happy with. You mentioned in the other thread something along the lines that that with Kim everything clicks, whereas with Pixies 2.0 there's an awkwardness of goth wearing cowboy boots. I think that's a good description, but I come down on the other side of finding the latter oddly compelling. For all the diversity on NLYM, most of the songs sound like tasteful, competent indie/alt songs that I've heard before (even the more experimental tracks), whereas Pixies takes on British murder ballads, Phil Spector, and late-era Leonard Cohen is more of a left-turn for me.
Without calling for a disbanding of the Pixies, I do agree that it would be nice if Charles could record with a greater diversity of musicians to reflect his different interests. |
Edited by - Brank_Flack on 12/13/2024 08:44:31 |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6256 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 10:03:19
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What about this one: if Frank releases a record I'm all over it, from the get go. Even the bad ones.
I know Kim's new record is better, at least the singles were, but I only listened to it two times
I know Kim is cooler and better in being an indie goddes. I love her. But Frank is not interested in making those records.
I don't think he can, to be honest.
But I'm all up for it. For anything. Make a hip hop record, I don't care. Even the duds. Bring 'em on.
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BF: Mag ik Engels spreken? |
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Mad Lucas
- FB Fan -
Australia
186 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2024 : 10:38:31
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The most interesting thing about the Kim album is the change in lyrical style, dealing with mortality, existence etc from the perspective of someone ageing. It is striking to hear after so much of her prior work is clouded in abstraction lyrically (not a bad thing). Couple that with the fact she still has all her musical powers, unlike other artists who make this shift post age-60, and it makes a compelling package.
Nonetheless, I can't get away from the fact that she's returning to many of the same wells. I wonder during recording how many takes she re-records because she played the part too correctly, or gave the impression she was trying too hard. Like at some point, when you're getting a horn section on your album, you've shown your hand that you're doing your best. You don't need to do the performative sloppiness thing. But that's what I'm getting at with her prioritising aesthetic or attitude. I think that approach really paid off on Title TK, but there are diminishing returns. |
Edited by - Mad Lucas on 12/13/2024 10:39:30 |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 02/11/2025 : 01:50:25
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I Hear You Mary has REALLY grown on me
One of my favorite tracks now
Typical grower of FBF, love it now |
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Troubles A Foot
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1029 Posts |
Posted - 02/11/2025 : 07:28:55
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| I have not even listened to this album since those first few weeks when it came out, and I don't feel particularly compelled to. |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 02/11/2025 : 12:15:14
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I feel you Trouble
I hope that someday you’ll be able to enjoy these Frank tunes too
I can sort of relate when it comes to TMBG. I can’t stomach a single one of their songs beside the first album, which is brilliant. It’s like they’re not even the same band or that they lost all their talent, which might be how you feel about these FBF songs |
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Troubles A Foot
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1029 Posts |
Posted - 02/11/2025 : 16:44:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Bedbug
I can sort of relate when it comes to TMBG. I can’t stomach a single one of their songs beside the first album, which is brilliant. It’s like they’re not even the same band or that they lost all their talent, which might be how you feel about these FBF songs
Their first album and their next two had all the same songs they wrote around the same time in the mid 80s, and their second album was made immediately after with the same producer and a lot of the same technology. What you say doesn't really make a lot of sense.
Compare that to the Pixies album which is a radical change in style and sound and made decades after their best work. On top of that, basically every TMBG fan prefers their next few albums over the first one, with Lincoln and Flood being huge fan favorites, whereas I doubt I can find a couple Pixies fans who would have a similar sentiment about their latest work. |
Edited by - Troubles A Foot on 02/11/2025 16:46:09 |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2025 : 02:59:47
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I'll have to take your word for it Trouble, I'm not much of a TMBG fan as you probably can tell. I just know what my opinion is of their first three albums.
My bigger point was just that I feel sad that you're such a big fan of Charles music but that you dislike his new albums so much. For some of us this is one of the greatest periods in FBF history. Wish you could have that too. Maybe you'll come around to these albums someday (like I did with Indie Cindy). |
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two reelers
* Dog in the Sand *
Austria
1059 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2025 : 04:04:32
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I don't think there is a need to be sad about this. We like some things, and we dislike some things. Quite natural, I think, and gladly we can have this variation.
I for myself also cannot get excited too much about Pixies 2.0 output, I did not even buy the last two albums nor IC for that matter. It was like this from the beginning when those albums came out, and I don't expect a change here. I think by far their best 2.0 record are the BTE demos, but even those I have not revisited much after some time.
I joined the cult of Souled American / 'cause they are a damn' fine band |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2025 : 05:21:52
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This reminds me of the day TLM came out. Bought the cassette and loved it instantly, but you would not believe how many people were like "this is even worse than Bossanova!" I'm like "Are you crazy?"
Two Reelers, do you still dislike Indie Cindy?
For those of you who dislike the last decade of what Frank has created and given to us, what do you listen to? |
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two reelers
* Dog in the Sand *
Austria
1059 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2025 : 07:28:59
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Yes, I still don't get excited about Indy Cindy, and I cannot be bothered to listen to it (which is all different from "dislike").
I also don't actively put on Surfer Rosa or Dolittle on the record player, but when by chance I listen to it, I still say to 95% "wow, that's really great and outstanding!". But for 85% of Pixies 2.0, I go "it is nice, but if I would not know this I don't think I would have missed something essential."
COP, Bossanova, TLM, all FB solo, Catholics, 50% of post-Catholics FB/BF - this is what I actively put on the record player, and don't get tired to listen to. Never could get into Grand Duchy.
I joined the cult of Souled American / 'cause they are a damn' fine band |
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Troubles A Foot
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1029 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2025 : 07:32:03
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| I listen to Catholics all the time. I listened to the first Frank solo album a huge amount because I made a podcast about it a few months ago. I listen to the Beneath Beneath the Eyrie (my name) demos all the time. But mostly I put on the Catholics on shuffle when I'm in the mood for Frank. Oh, I also listen to Oddballs a lot. It's one of my favorite releases. |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2025 : 08:21:09
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The other night I was telling some people about the Frank concert we went to, and they'd never really heard of him beyond WIMM, so I played 3 of his songs for them:
The Lord Has Come Back Today
Mercy Me
The Vegas Suite
They were blown away, instant new fans. Imagine when they cycle all the way through to Doolittle and TOTY.
I listen to the 2.0 stuff all the time. It's my favorite era of his right now. Hope we get 10 more albums of 2.0 stuff, and then a bunch of solo projects too.
And also Two Reelers, have you listened to much of the live shows of Indie Cindy stuff? That's actually what really opened my eyes up to it. There are some Snakes and Mag318 out there that are spectacular. |
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Brank_Flack
* Dog in the Sand *
Canada
1059 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2025 : 09:55:19
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Wow, I'm surprised they were blown away by the Lord Has Come Back Today - that's at most a pleasant grower for me, and I'm friendlier to 2.0 than most!
I like 2.0 but I don't think it's either a peak or a nadir of his career (although BTE is one of my favourite FBF albums and I think IC is criminally underrated). |
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Skatealex1
* Dog in the Sand *
1701 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2025 : 19:07:47
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quote:
Originally posted by Bedbug
This reminds me of the day TLM came out. Bought the cassette and loved it instantly, but you would not believe how many people were like "this is even worse than Bossanova!" I'm like "Are you crazy?"
Two Reelers, do you still dislike Indie Cindy?
For those of you who dislike the last decade of what Frank has created and given to us, what do you listen to?
I'll start with a caveat that I like some newer music from Frank but I find especially the last two haven't got me 'blown away' for the most part. For me Dogerrel was kind of a point where I found a lot of it fairly boring- minus a few highlights like the open and closer on that.
The latest Pixies album I think might be a bit better at least- some highlights for me- like Primrose and Oyster Beds.
BTE and the demos are possibly the Pixies 2.0 highlight for me. Indie Cindy- I do think it has good songs but as has been stated in past threads feels simply over produced. Would love to hear a more raw version of it.
As for what I listen to otherwise- I find a lot of modern shoegaze is quite good when I'm in the mood for some atmospheric stuff that has energy. The latest Diiv record for example I thought was quality.
Sometimes on drives I may kinda dive into an artists work that comes to mind for whatever reason, catch up on new songs or listen more to past favorite kinda stuff.
Some artists that sometimes can enter into the rotation on the road- bands like Fishmans (they have some fun indie kinda stuff), Animal Collective, Modest Mouse, TV on the Radio, Pinback, Sigur Ros, Bjork, Broken Social Scene, Boards of Canada.. |
Edited by - Skatealex1 on 02/14/2025 19:45:38 |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6256 Posts |
Posted - 02/14/2025 : 05:47:10
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I enjoy almost everything FBF has put out
I'm a fan and a supporter
Can't help it
I do think some records are better than others of course.
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BF: Mag ik Engels spreken? |
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Mad Lucas
- FB Fan -
Australia
186 Posts |
Posted - 02/14/2025 : 19:51:07
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I love 2.0 on the whole, very few songs which I skip (Ring The Bell and Pagan Man come to mind) and a ton of sublime moments.
I'm primarily a jazz fan and that perhaps set me up to enjoy 2.0 in the sense that in jazz there is a high value placed on an artist maturing and deepening their 'sound' and the musical world they produce. There's less of an importance placed on freshness or novelty.
It's plainly true that FBF works within the same broad format (rocknroll music) and his points of reference have remained the same for decades.
Nonetheless I think when you have a true great still trying to find new nuances within their method and responding to the times and tides this is a wonderful thing.
In a musical landscape full of superficiality and novelty and postmodern retro, artists like FBF or Kristin Hersh are a salve.
Also the music just sounds good. |
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two reelers
* Dog in the Sand *
Austria
1059 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2025 : 01:22:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Mad Lucas
I love 2.0 on the whole, very few songs which I skip (Ring The Bell and Pagan Man come to mind) and a ton of sublime moments.
I'm primarily a jazz fan and that perhaps set me up to enjoy 2.0 in the sense that in jazz there is a high value placed on an artist maturing and deepening their 'sound' and the musical world they produce. There's less of an importance placed on freshness or novelty.
It's plainly true that FBF works within the same broad format (rocknroll music) and his points of reference have remained the same for decades.
Nonetheless I think when you have a true great still trying to find new nuances within their method and responding to the times and tides this is a wonderful thing.
In a musical landscape full of superficiality and novelty and postmodern retro, artists like FBF or Kristin Hersh are a salve.
Also the music just sounds good.
That’s an interesting viewpoint, thanks for the input. Since I am definitely not into jazz, it correlates well with my perception/reception of Pixies 1.0 vs. 2.0.
I however tend to slightly disagree with the statement that 2.0 is less fresh/novel (when compared to 1.0). I think the production and song structures are different (e.g. more polished, longer songs, more „classic“ rock structures), which makes them novel in the FBF universe. And I guess some people enjoy this and some not so much.
I joined the cult of Souled American / 'cause they are a damn' fine band |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2025 : 05:25:29
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| It’s great to see all the love for 2.0 |
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Troubles A Foot
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1029 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2025 : 08:41:37
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quote:
Originally posted by Mad Lucas
Also the music just sounds good.
I just don't think it does. That's part of the problem. The production, and this specific producer in charge of picking the songs and making so many arrangement decisions is ruining what could be fantastic work from Frank and the Pixies.
I listened to the album another time yesterday. I think I liked it even less. I think there's only two or three songs I enjoy on it. Besides my disappointment with NonStopErotik, I never thought I'd dislike one of his albums to this degree so I'm not happy to report that.
Seeing Teenager of the Year live only further cemented my disappointment with the recent output. I kept thinking during the show why can't he do something close to this anymore? Even for just a few songs. |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2025 : 09:09:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Troubles A Foot
quote:
Originally posted by Mad Lucas
Also the music just sounds good.
I just don't think it does. That's part of the problem. The production, and this specific producer in charge of picking the songs and making so many arrangement decisions is ruining what could be fantastic work from Frank and the Pixies.
I listened to the album another time yesterday. I think I liked it even less. I think there's only two or three songs I enjoy on it. Besides my disappointment with NonStopErotik, I never thought I'd dislike one of his albums to this degree so I'm not happy to report that.
Seeing Teenager of the Year live only further cemented my disappointment with the recent output. I kept thinking during the show why can't he do something close to this anymore? Even for just a few songs.
I think NSE is fantastic, it's like Frank's Wild at Heart
I was thinking that some people love / don't love 2.0 because it sounds more like mainstream music, but now I don't know. It kind of doesn't sound like anything else really. |
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Troubles A Foot
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1029 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2025 : 09:37:48
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But that's the problem with it. It's like neither fish nor fowl. Frank is having the Pixies be his backup band for what is most often country-ish, Catholics and solo material, then on top of that you have a producer seemingly trying to give them a hit or make them sound as mainstream and slick as possible, but that doesn't quite work either.
This is why many of the songs on these albums sound purposeless and awkward to me. |
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Skatealex1
* Dog in the Sand *
1701 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2025 : 10:03:47
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quote:
Originally posted by Troubles A Foot
But that's the problem with it. It's like neither fish nor fowl. Frank is having the Pixies be his backup band for what is most often country-ish, Catholics and solo material, then on top of that you have a producer seemingly trying to give them a hit or make them sound as mainstream and slick as possible, but that doesn't quite work either.
This is why many of the songs on these albums sound purposeless and awkward to me.
I agree with this. What I find kind of annoying as a fan with a producer like Tom working with Frank- I feel like he encourages mediocrity rather than pushing for something more interesting. Or if not mediocrity it's like putting Pixies with a classic rock producer rather than producers into stuff like indie rock, etc.
I also obviously don't know what the output would be like with other producers or band situations (IE- working with the TOTY band or Catholics) but definitely when seeing them live nowdays, it feels like Pixies are clocking it in for the most part.
At the TOTY show FB seemed way more engaged than I've seen him at any Pixies shows over the past who knows how many years. |
Edited by - Skatealex1 on 02/15/2025 11:43:07 |
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Bedbug
> Teenager of the Year <
3229 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2025 : 11:03:51
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Maybe because I know nothing about music I don't hang as much of the whole thing on the producer's shoulders as I should?
Yes I can tell the difference in sounds between SR and TLM, and between 1.0 and 2.0, but I also feel like from CoP to TNTZC is all one unified FBF "thing"
Are we saying that if Tom D produced SR in 1988 and Steve A produced the next 2.0 album we would end up with vastly different finished products?
And when the man himself produced CoR very few at the time (certainly not me) were like, "this thing rocks!"
But I defer to the musicians on the forum.
I totally agree that it seems that Pixies live performances could be seen as "clocking it in." Rare exceptions to that phenomenon exist for artists in their 60s I would imagine. And that right there is why the 2.0 thing is also good, because maybe that's where Frank is. I'm blown away that he can still shriek it out on the 1.0 stuff live as good as he does.
BTW Trouble I do think your neither fish nor fowl thought makes an interesting point |
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The Night The Zombies Came
