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edbanky
= Cult of Ray =
Burkina Faso (Upper Volta)
388 Posts |
 Posted - 06/14/2006 : 11:27:42
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What are your thoughts on the supernatural? What, if anything, in the supernatural realm, do you accept as legitimate?
By supernatural, I mean stuff like:
Ghosts
God(s)
Auras
Telepathy
Clairvoyance
Pyschokinesis
Spirit/Soul
Levitation
I know people's ideas of supernatural will differ; in fact, I wouldn't be surprised if believers in particular supernatural phenomena would resent their pet idea being called supernatural. I get that part. Please mention other supernatural phenomena as necessary.
I am especially interested in how people have arrived at their (dis/)belief in these things?
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"Clinton is a shithead." Ray Bradbury |
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Carl
- A 'Fifth' Catholic -
Ireland
11546 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 11:29:17
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I don't believe in-wait, there's a ghost!
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El Loco
- FB Fan -
206 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 11:40:58
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Ghosts - yes, my new house is haunted somewhat, my wife is now a believer. i think it's kind of cool though.
God(s) - I am
Auras - i don't believe
Telepathy - yes, has anyone seen that parrot that can see thru her owners eyes. weird shit.
Clairvoyance - maybe but i would have to confirm thru a channeling that i'm present for
Pyschokinesis - i don't believe
Spirit/Soul - i hope so
Levitation - no but i did astral project once. |
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s_wrenn
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1851 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 11:56:02
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If more people watched 'Penn And Teller: Bullshit!' they'd know that everything listed above is....well, bullshit.
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn  |
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edbanky
= Cult of Ray =
Burkina Faso (Upper Volta)
388 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 12:04:12
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quote:
Originally posted by s_wrenn
If more people watched 'Penn And Teller: Bullshit!' they'd know that everything listed above is....well, bullshit.
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn
I wish't I could watch it. Heard good things about it. Loved the other day watching Robert Osborne on TCM chatting it up with them, and him having to repeat, "The duo's Showtime (HBO?) series, Bullshit, is currently BLAH BLAH BLAH . . ." during segments. I expected him to opt for "BS". Second only to Kevin Rocker, TCM is Ted Turner's next-to-supreme legacy.
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"Clinton is a shithead." Ray Bradbury |
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Llamadance
> Teenager of the Year <
United Kingdom
2543 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 12:10:06
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Ghosts and Clairvoyance are the only maybe's, though I'd love for Psychokinesis and levitation to be true.
Reasons are that both my wife and one of my exes have parents that claim to have such powers/talked to ghosts and such like. My mother-in-law claims to be clairvoyant and apparently is extremely accurate. I've never seen it in action myself. My wife believes it though.
The other one, her father regularly used ouija boards and stuff. There was one time where he was in Abu Dhabi (they lived in Glasgow) and her younger brother was cutting the grass and ran over the cable, electrocuting himself. They saved him, which was great, but within minutes, the father phoned and instantly asked what was wrong with his son.
Hardly conclusive, but thought provoking stuff.
What lies before us and what lies behind us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us -Ralph Waldo Emerson
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s_wrenn
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1851 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 12:11:27
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I love P&T. Especially when they had to explain to viewers that they couldn't call certain people liars etc, for legal reasons, but it was alright to call them Motherfuckers and Cocksuckers as a replacement word.
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn |
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Frog in the Sand
-+ Le premiere frog +-
France
2715 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 12:55:12
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quote:
Originally posted by edbanky
Ghosts
God(s)
Auras
Telepathy
Clairvoyance
Pyschokinesis
Spirit/Soul
Levitation
Funny, I'm currently working on a possible hypothetical TV series that deals with all these things.
To answer your question, I'm interested in anything that questions reality and the so-called boundary between mind and matter.
Oh, and you forgot UFOs. I can imagine a world without soccer, but I can't imagine a world without UFOs, whatever they are.
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 blackolero le only Frank Black / Pixies site 100% in français |
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edbanky
= Cult of Ray =
Burkina Faso (Upper Volta)
388 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 13:13:25
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Hey Frog, I didn't mention UFOs because I think that IF they exist (I mean beyond the literal meaning of UFO), they're tangible, according to believers, themselves, whereas the other items are either invisible/intangible or appear to violate physical law. Or maybe I am all mixed up.
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"Clinton is a shithead." Ray Bradbury |
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TRANSMARINE
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
2002 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 14:00:45
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What if 'UFO's' and 'aliens' and 'ghosts' are all the same thing? UFO's may simply be time machines of sorts from other Terran time-planes (since when they are tracked or spotted, it's never outside the atmosphere)...thus the 'aliens' may just be us in a future-tense. Now, perhaps the appearance of 'alien beings' to those who claim close-encounters or abduction, use an alternate form of time-travel created much further ahead of the UFO-as-time-machine theory (maybe like a Star Trek transporter beam, or a Dune-like folding of spacial area?)...thus, our futureselves appearing and vanishing in time giving the idea of a 'ghost'? I'm becoming convoluted in my thoughts here, but maybe the alien phenomenon and the paranormal are one in the same in some way. This raises the question of why would we time-skip in the future? Especially when we would know it would freak the bejeezus out of our lowly present selves. I don't know. Just a thought.
Hank the 8th was a duplicated man
-bRIAN |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 14:21:53
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i think the liklihood of aliens existing is very low but i do think Predator probably exists
"I don't have any money to buy new clothes and if they paid me to get some I'd probably buy more hoodies." - Mark Wainfur |
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Carl
- A 'Fifth' Catholic -
Ireland
11546 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 17:30:59
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And I don't belive in aliens, but I believe in Aliens.
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s_wrenn
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1851 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 17:43:40
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Well to think we we're the only intelligent race of beings in the entire universe would be a bit big of us.
There is bound to be life scattered through-out the vast quantities of galaxies that surround us. The problem is that to travel to the nearest planet with the possibility of life on it would take around a thousand years.
So we may never know.
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn |
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PixieSteve
> Teenager of the Year <
Poland
4698 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 17:56:05
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hope i'm not the only one who can say NO to all of them
FAST_MAN RAIDER_MAN - June 19th |
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floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 18:29:03
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quote:
Originally posted by s_wrenn
Well to think we we're the only intelligent race of beings in the entire universe would be a bit big of us.
There is bound to be life scattered through-out the vast quantities of galaxies that surround us. The problem is that to travel to the nearest planet with the possibility of life on it would take around a thousand years.
So we may never know.
it wouldn't take Predator a thousand years
"I don't have any money to buy new clothes and if they paid me to get some I'd probably buy more hoodies." - Mark Wainfur |
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darwin
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
5456 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 21:24:06
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quote:
Originally posted by PixieSteve
hope i'm not the only one who can say NO to all of them
FAST_MAN RAIDER_MAN - June 19th
NO |
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BLT
> Teenager of the Year <
South Sandwich Islands
4204 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 23:01:14
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| I saw one episode of Penn & Teller's "Bullshit" about organic and GM foods. It was more of an attempt to rile people than to show any sensible discussion about the issues. Naturally since they probably couldn't argue their points well against anyone sensible and knowledgeable, they brought on some hippie commune organic food freaks and presented them as evidence that anyone who eats organic must be a wacko. The part I saw made me think P&T must be sponsored by Monsanto...they were about as unbiased as Bill O'Reilly. |
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Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 23:05:23
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No to all. The "soul" is the one that really gets me because so many people believe in "it" without being able to begin to define what it is. At least with "ghosts" believers can refer to some attributes or effects, which are then dismissed by skeptics, but for "soul" the believers can't offer even a single remotely credible characteristic.
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edbanky
= Cult of Ray =
Burkina Faso (Upper Volta)
388 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2006 : 23:07:35
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Eagerly awaiting Floop's Predator vs. Chuck Norris chain email . . .
Transmarine: That's an interesting idea--UFOs being us in the future. I figure time travel will never occur (since no one has ever come back to tell us) UNLESS we somehow end up doing a nice job of containing the time travel to a few dubious "sightings." It would also make perfect sense for future humans to intentionally target the ostensibly less credible of our kind.
The only reason I see this as unlikely is that it seems like the technology could not be contained to the extent necessary. One possibility: a government succeeds marginally at time travel, but in its clandestine trails, realizes it just isn't a viable overall idea, and abandons it.
Stuff.
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"Clinton is a shithead." Ray Bradbury |
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Frog in the Sand
-+ Le premiere frog +-
France
2715 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 01:01:43
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According to C.G. Jung, Freud's most famous disciple, UFOs are neither real nor fictive, they directly originate from the collective unconscious, just like "ghosts" originate from the individual unconscious. So maybe they're linked to psychokinesis or something like that. Just an idea.
OK, aspirin please.
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blackolero le only Frank Black / Pixies site 100% in français |
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Frog in the Sand
-+ Le premiere frog +-
France
2715 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 01:09:38
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By the way edbanky, I've just read your bio... Impressive!
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blackolero le only Frank Black / Pixies site 100% in français |
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cassandra is
> Teenager of the Year <
France
4233 Posts |
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cassandra is
> Teenager of the Year <
France
4233 Posts |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 06:07:20
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I grew up around a lot of witches, healers and other familial kooks so I´ll probably be outside the consensus on this one. Telepathic moments I have with friends quite frequently - I think of something and someone else says it or I look at the phone expecting it to ring and it rings, but all I can offer is anecdotal evidence. My brother had an accident last year in Dublin and while I was in France I knew something was up. It´s one of those things helps me feel that with respect to consciousness there is no such thing as location. Too, unless you´re willing to be sensitive to it, you might not experience it.
I don´t subscribe to these physicalistic philosophies which equate mental states with brain states. A pattern I notice is a few decades before a society starts goosestepping, the upper ends of the intelligentsia start suppressing kinder philosophies that see matter and spirit as one in favour of more mechanistic ones, people being that much easier to lead to war when they see themselves as insignificant glots of chemical reactions. Guy credited with helping foment the paradigm shift forerunning Nazi Germany was Wilhelm Wundt (1882-1920), having banished the soul from psychological research (even though "psyche" means "soul" in the original Greek) and sanctifying the primacy of matter. The German end of things taken care of, Wundt had an American student called G. Stanley Hall who established the American Journal in Psychology, helped both found the American Psychological Association and boost the carer of one John Dewey.
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Gravy boat! Stay in the now! |
Edited by - Newo on 06/15/2006 06:13:58 |
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misleadtheworld
* Dog in the Sand *
United Kingdom
1222 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 07:47:12
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I find it funny when people say "oh it's so arrogant of us to think that our planet has the only life in the universe". Usually I find these people are adamant athiests, and though not particularly religous myself, I do think Life is quite a surprising and special thing. Whenever I watch one of David Attenborough's programmes I'm always left thinking 'what! why! how! oh! wow! That's amazing!' It seems funny that one planet can have billions of different species living in incredibly varied, often hostile environments, where planets in our own solar system have no apparent evidence of life throughout their billions of years of changing existance. I realise that's quite sweeping as we've not fine-tooth combed every rock in our solar system, but you know what I mean.
I don't believe extra-terrestrials have visited us, though I'm certainly not ruling out the existance of life elsewhere in the universe. I'd love for us to find some monsters, though.
I don't believe in ghosts (dead people among us) but I'll make exceptions for 'spirits', I suppose. Differentiating 'spirit' from 'soul', that is. I don't know what a soul would constitute, as erebus questions. The part of you that is 'life', perhaps? I don't know. Spirits? Yeah, weird.
I don't like to rule anything out, generally, but ghosts, I'm quite happy to. If the dead were really around walking and whatnot, seeing how awful a lot of people felt about losing said person, you'd think they'd have the decency to appear and say 'okay, sorry, it's alright, I'm still here, just messin' with ya. So, Starbucks?'.
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11690 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 08:00:52
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Interesting...
Ghosts - sometimes. I'm willing to accept they may exist but am extremely skeptical/looking for a more obvious explanation when presented with stories.
God - yup.
Auras - Hmmm... not in the metaphysical sense. People definitely carry their mood around them but otherwise, I don't think there's an energy field resulting.
Telepathy - Yup. Why not? Just being sensitive to and able to interpret electromagnetic signals.
Clairvoyance - See 'ghosts'. My mom has had dreams, on several occasions, where she dreamt someone died and received a phone call the next day saying that. She's also had plenty of nightmares where people die and don't the next day.
Psychokinesis - I have trouble since I don't know how the mind would exert the force necessary, but I'd _like_ to. Who doesn't want to use the Force?
Spirit/Soul - Sure.
Levitation - See psycho/telekinesis.
 "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." |
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TRANSMARINE
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
2002 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 08:30:43
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quote:
Originally posted by edbanky
Eagerly awaiting Floop's Predator vs. Chuck Norris chain email . . .
Transmarine: That's an interesting idea--UFOs being us in the future. I figure time travel will never occur (since no one has ever come back to tell us) UNLESS we somehow end up doing a nice job of containing the time travel to a few dubious "sightings." It would also make perfect sense for future humans to intentionally target the ostensibly less credible of our kind.
The only reason I see this as unlikely is that it seems like the technology could not be contained to the extent necessary. One possibility: a government succeeds marginally at time travel, but in its clandestine trails, realizes it just isn't a viable overall idea, and abandons it.
Stuff.
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"Clinton is a shithead." Ray Bradbury
Well, I see your point...however, why would our futureselves risk telling our presentselves? This would be hazardous to the existence of our futureselves. Also, technology could have advanced by that point to allow time manipulation. Could it be possible that we wouldn't even need machines to do that? Of course, I don't know...but somewhere down our evolutionary line we may be able to eliminate the action in a physical motivation=action=goal. According to the current, we only use something like 8% of our brain. By the time we can use 20%, we might not even be using a number system anymore (of course, there would be no more 'using a numerical percentage of our brain' grammar).
UFO's exist, I believe. A lot of stories I don't discount. They are simply unidentifiable for the moment. I also believe in the existence of other intelligent life in the universe. It would be stupid not to. But it's hard for me to understand why aliens would visit so secretly, and never present themselves as neighbors, and yet mistakenly be seen now and again before whooshing away. Humans (in some form) hiding and being occasionally caught strikes me as more reasonable, as this is a historical trend.
I came across a 'science' book at Border's Books last night that reminded me of this thread, and I bought it. It's called TELEPORTAION, and it's somewhat interesting. Hypothetical science-fact culled from science-fiction of the purported study (and supposed execution in some experiments!!!) of molecular deconstrution and replacement in a new area as a travel alternative ("beam me up").
Whatever.
Hank the 8th was a duplicated man
-bRIAN |
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s_wrenn
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1851 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 09:40:11
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The main reason our solar system only has us and our animal buddies living in it is due to our distance from the sun.
Every planet that needs to support life has to have water at a liquid state. And we're just in the right spot.
Scientist always rave about Europa having vast oceans that could harbour life (micro-organisms mainly) under it's frozen exterior but maybe their hopes are a little too high.
And what's the story with Mars? I heard a lot of fuss being made about the fact that it used to have water. And then all the talk stopped.
Meh! I say let them find us if they're out there.
I doubt we'll find them, we only found out we had a tenth planet in the last two or three years! Even worse, some people still can't believe it's not butter. Is that how want to be seen as an intergalactic race??
And as for ghost, watch an episode of Most Haunted and judge for yourself.
"*SCREAMS* What was that noise?"
"That was my shoe"
Later:
"*SCREAMS* Oh my god what was that?"
"It was me again"
Comical!
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn |
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TRANSMARINE
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
2002 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 10:01:56
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quote:
Originally posted by s_wrenn
we only found out we had a tenth planet in the last two or three years! http://myspace.com/seanwrenn
Actually that's not true. UB313 is not yet classified as a planet. As it resides in the trans-Neptunian region of our solar system, scientists and scholars are still battling the idea of what to label the thing. It has caused so much controversyas to consider stripping Pluto and it's moon Cheron of it's planet label, and slapping on it the title of TNO (trans-Neptunian Object...how's that for a generic name!). Everything beyond Neptune is junk...rock, ice and methane particles, and dead comets, believed to have drifted in from the Kuiper belt and caught in orbits. In fact, over 900 '10th planet' possibilities have been discovered over the past 30 years...most just hunks of asteroid drifted into the Kuiper belt, which most likely originated in the Oort Cloud as once live comets. UB313 was first detected mathematically back in 1978 and termed (albiet unofficially) Planet X ('x' or 10, whatever your preference) and caused a lot of whacky speculation as to what secrets, supernatural, religious, and scientific, it possessed. Now we know it to be a rock slathered with methane.
As for Mars, the most fascinating thing is the 'fossil' that recovered in 1996. Anyone remeber this? It was touted in the media AND the government for all of 3 days before TOTALLY vanishing. It cropped up as a footnote in the 1997 fictional science funhouse CONTACT starring the awful Jodie Foster (I had to throw in personal feelings there...sorry).
Hank the 8th was a duplicated man
-bRIAN |
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s_wrenn
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1851 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 10:11:31
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UB313 recently was shown to have several moons though. They also claim it has a hard rock core with an ice layer. If they do decide to classify it as a planet then i hope they won't go with the rubbish "Xena" that some have being calling it. They even started naming the moon after Xena's sidekick in the show (the blonde one).
I didn't know UB313 was found in 1978. Most sites state the full name as UB313 2003, saying it was discovered in 2003 and not officially confirmed till 2005.
Wikipedia has a good page on it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UB313
Surprising that UB313 is a TNO if it's bigger than Pluto.
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn |
Edited by - s_wrenn on 06/15/2006 10:22:13 |
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TRANSMARINE
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
2002 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 10:23:59
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quote:
Originally posted by s_wrenn
UB313 recently was shown to have several moons though. They also claim it has a hard rock core with an ice layer. If they do decide to classify it as a planet then i hope they won't go with the rubbish "Xena" that some have being calling it. They even started naming the moon after Xena's sidekick in the show (the blonde one).
I didn't know UB313 was found in 1978. Most sites state the full name as UB313 2003, saying it was discovered in 2003 and not officially confirmed till 2005.
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn
What became known as Planet X was speculated as far back as the early 1900's, while Pluto was speculated as well. In 1978 it was physically determined to be there but to correct myself, not labeled 'UB313' until 2005. You are right in that it was first photographed in 2003, but missed by sight in said photograph until 2005. And yes, there are objects near it, but experts are refraining from terming them offically as 'moons' because UB313 is not yet called a planet.
Hank the 8th was a duplicated man
-bRIAN |
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misleadtheworld
* Dog in the Sand *
United Kingdom
1222 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 10:41:37
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I remember reading (or watching) a thing about the so-called fossil from Mars. It wasn't a fossil. What looked like fossilised bacteria, well, wasn't. I think it was a BBC 'Horizon' documentary actually. Turned out to be some sort of naturally occurring pocket of...something. Or other. I forget.
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s_wrenn
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1851 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 10:47:33
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In recent years speculation has grown again, however – prodded by a study of the ALH84001 meteorite which concluded that it contained fossilized microbes. Other scientists have subsequently sought to explain these findings on the basis of chemical processes. Both remain highly controversial within the scientific community.
Another glimmer of hope for past and present life on Mars has been revealed with the ongoing research into extremophiles on Earth which survive under the harshest conditions. Some scientists have proposed a biological origin for the annual appearance and disappearance of dark dune spots near the polar regions of Mars.
Arthur C Clarke has also expressed his belief that certain organic-looking areas in photograph MO8 04688 from the Mars Orbiter Camera probably represent tree-like organisms. These images were taken at latitude -82.02°, longitude 284.38°, near to the Martian south pole. If the 'trees' were any form of life, they would be on a scale unknown to Earth: some of the Martian 'trees' would be one kilometre in diameter.
From Wikipedia
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn |
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TRANSMARINE
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
2002 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 10:49:00
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Leave it to the British to debunk extraterrestral fossils! 
Hank the 8th was a duplicated man
-bRIAN |
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s_wrenn
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1851 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 10:56:24
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Sticking with Mars for a sec.
The Face, mound of dust or an ancient structure? Whadaya think?
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn |
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TRANSMARINE
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
2002 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2006 : 11:46:23
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quote:
Originally posted by s_wrenn
Sticking with Mars for a sec.
The Face, mound of dust or an ancient structure? Whadaya think?
http://myspace.com/seanwrenn
It's always interesting to see...there's no doubt it resembles a visage...the mound below it looks kinda like a frog (Hangwire?), while the one lower right kinda looks like a chick (as in baby chicken...Bird Dream of the Olympus Mons?)...to the left of that we see what appear to be mice (Abstract Plain?), and lower right of that, some sort of Manta Ray (mine's all right)...which leaves us with the mound in the lower left which has an apparent shadow draping it...perhaps the shadow of the lonely astronaut's spacecraft as it makes it's fall into the mountain .
Hank the 8th was a duplicated man
-bRIAN |
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Topic |
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Supernatural beliefs?
