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starmekitten
-= Forum Pistolera =-
United Kingdom
6370 Posts |
 Posted - 03/12/2005 : 14:47:21
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In a collective push to get our song db as chock full of information as possible, we're going to experiment with posting a new song every couple days to the forum.
This is where you come in. If you know anything about the song (or are interested in trying to find out through some skilled sleuthing) then the idea is that you post your knowledge (with source if possible).
If it's conjecture, that's great too (just please label it as such), because it'll help get people talking.
El Barto, the Song DB Master, will then take what elements he can from the thread and put them into the db. It should be full of tidbits in no time!
What sort of information are we looking for? Anything that gives insight into the song's meaning, creation, etc for one. As well, interesting nuggets of information.
Examples:
- Descriptions of (possible) song references
- Quotes from FB or other notables on the song
- Definitions to words you think might not be immediately obvious
If you're not sure about something, post and ask! You may jog someone's memory. - Cult_Of_Frank
already in db....
http://frankblack.net/songs/db.asp?mode=release-song-details&releaseID=109&songID=175
Available on:
Show Me Your Tears [Album - September 9, 2003]
Lyrics:
When she said she did not love me
That's when I lost all hope
So I jumped into a river
Called The New House Of The Pope
Now some they want their coffee
And some just want their dope
But lately I've been drinking
At The New House Of The Pope
Now I do not even know, dear
Who has made this symphony
But he gave you thirteen kisses
And that's why you taste so sweet
In the evening I want my coffee
And in the morning I want my dope
And in the afternoons I'm drinking
In the New House Of The Pope
Yeah, lately I've been drinking
At The New House Of The Pope
 cats have nine lives/ which makes them ideal for experimentation |
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VoVat
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
9168 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 14:53:52
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This song is about Avignon, which was the "New House of the Pope" during the Great Schism.
Okay, it probably isn't, but that would be cool.
"Reunion? Shit union!" |
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The Susquatch
- FB Fan -
Ireland
95 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 18:34:02
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I love the blues in this song. It sounds like a guy whose just given up for the time and is pouring his heart out. Drink is just whats left. This is one of the best from SMYT
Hang on to your Taco! |
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kathryn
~ Selkie Bride ~
Belgium
15320 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 20:06:41
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Brace yourselves. We're about to enter a scary dimension,
where Papal history and vintner-geekdom meet.
Another warning: I hope this makes sense. Off the top of my fuzzy head late at night.
The New House of the Pope = in French Châteauneuf-du-Pape
Châteauneuf-du-Pape = a wine named after the so-called "Babylonian captivity of the papacy," which began in 1309 (I think that's the right date...long ago history class) when Pope Clement V, who was French, pulled a power move and moved the papal residence to Avignon (in the Southern Rhone Valley). He did this totally for political reasons -- it made France stronger to have the pope sit in France. This marked the only time the pope did not sit at the Vatican. It lasted until 1377 (I think) when Pope Gregory XI took the whole she-bang back to Rome (another FB+TheCs reference for ya, Tre!). Anyhoo, while the Babylonian captivity lasted, the pope and his peeps planted vineyards in the stony soil and they made red wine that they christened "Chateauneuf-du-Pape," "The new castle/house of the pope." So Frank's talking about wine here, folks. (There is also a village called Châteauneuf-du-Pape, near Avignon.)
More fun trivia! The 3 predominant grapes in this damn fine wine are Grenache, Syrah (a.k.a. Shiraz) and Mourvedre.
The wine-geek I am proud to call my husband says that
13 specific grape varieties may be used to make Chateauneuf-du-Pape, including some whites. But that's rarely the case now, most vintners use strictly red grapes. Mr. Kathryn claims to be able to quote each of the 13 permissible varieties, but that may be a little too esoteric for our db purposes here.
 I still believe in the excellent joy of the Catholics |
Edited by - kathryn on 03/12/2005 20:11:42 |
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starmekitten
-= Forum Pistolera =-
United Kingdom
6370 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 21:11:41
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Holy christ Kathryn
Thats good.
cats have nine lives/ which makes them ideal for experimentation |
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darwin
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
5454 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 21:16:13
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| Ahh, 13 kisses ... 13 varieties. Now we're getting somewhere. Thanks Kathryn. |
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VoVat
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
9168 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 10:12:04
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So I was actually partially right?
I'm scared, too.
"Reunion? Shit union!" |
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lonely persuader
= Cult of Ray =
Ireland
488 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 11:06:48
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Thats looks spot on there Kathryn..
Drag on the next song to be unravelled |
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kathryn
~ Selkie Bride ~
Belgium
15320 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 13:21:25
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I was somewhat reluctant to post the above, lest you mistake
me for one of those stuffy wine freaks who sits around
discussing a wine's "breeding" and "insouciance."
The only thing you'll hear me say while drinking wine
is "pour me something else, this sucks" or "oooh,
more" or "crank up Frank a little louder, wouldja?"
I still believe in the excellent joy of the Catholics |
Edited by - kathryn on 03/13/2005 13:24:05 |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 13:58:13
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Well, I did know about the wine, but not that much! That's great, especially the thirteen varieties of grape. I wonder if there's somewhere that can confirm it? Even if not, I think it still merits a plug into the db. Great job (and thanks)!
"Join the Cult of Frank / Seriously." |
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kathryn
~ Selkie Bride ~
Belgium
15320 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 14:08:59
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My guess is that it wouldn't be too hard for me to find "proof,"
if that would put your mind at ease. But I can also reassure
you that there are indeed 13 varieties ergo the 13 kisses.
Wine is just one of those (very few) things that I actually
know a little about, albeit at the cost of looking
like a drunk. But then again, Frank knows about there being
13 varieties so I'm in good company.
The wine world's a weird proscribed universe with certain
rigid, respected old-school laws, all stemming for very good reasons
(the integrity of the wine-making process = the integrity of the wine)
and all stemming from France.
I still believe in the excellent joy of the Catholics |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 14:40:39
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It has nothing to do with beliving or not believing you, it's just nice to have a source that we can pull a quote from, you know? I'm fairly certain you're correct and hence my excitement.
"Join the Cult of Frank / Seriously." |
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apl4eris
~ Abstract Brain ~
USA
4800 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 15:04:37
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"stemming"
heheh
kathryn, would you, or your knowledgeable Mr be so kind as to give us the names of the 13 kisses? I am intrigued and obsessive. It's getting worse as I age. <ahem>
<temporarily out of order> |
Edited by - apl4eris on 03/13/2005 15:05:14 |
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starmekitten
-= Forum Pistolera =-
United Kingdom
6370 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 15:05:44
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oh apl I gone got the giggles now
cats have nine lives/ which makes them ideal for experimentation |
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kathryn
~ Selkie Bride ~
Belgium
15320 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 18:48:20
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A quick google revealed this:
The wines of Chateauneuf-du-Pape are unique in that up to 13 grape varieties can be used – Grenache Noir, Syrah, Mourvedre, Cinsault, Muscardin, Vaccarese, Picpoul and Terret Noir, all red. Rousanne, Grenache Blanc, Clairette, Bourboulenc and Picardin are white and blended to lighten the colour and regulate the age ability of the wine.
From
http://www.foodreference.com/html/artchateauneuf.html
But, Dean, with a quick glance at the google results I saw
several places that listed the "13 kisses" (the 13 allowed grape
varieties).
Apl, I think you and I are of the same ilk. And Mr. Kathryn
and Spudboy, me thinks. We have little contests, little
can-you-name-all parlor games. While drinking, natch.
I still believe in the excellent joy of the Catholics |
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kathryn
~ Selkie Bride ~
Belgium
15320 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 18:54:02
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Stemming. I just saw that someone did notice that.
Of course it's you, dear Apl! Yay!
And in case anybody cares to travel deep into
geek territory with me (Apl?) the fact that some of
those permissible 13 varieties may be white is noteworthy
and interesting, no?
I still believe in the excellent joy of the Catholics |
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tobafett
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1713 Posts |
Posted - 01/23/2006 : 07:27:49
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Not of particular interest to this board maybe but Chateauneuf-de-Pape is mentioned in the Beastie Boys' Body Movin'
ps, I had to dig WAY back to find this :) |
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FrankfanL
- FB Fan -
USA
98 Posts |
Posted - 01/30/2006 : 19:31:30
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| Kathryn, Thanks so much for your info. One of my favorite SMYT songs, all the more sweeter with understanding. I suspected the wine connection, but your Pope explanation pulls it all together. And the 13 kisses...beautiful. Isn't THIS why we love Frank's music so darned much?? Well done, my dear!!! |
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Carl
- A 'Fifth' Catholic -
Ireland
11546 Posts |
Posted - 01/30/2006 : 23:54:51
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The piano on this reminds me of Dylan's Ballad Of A Thin Man!
 pas de dutchie! |
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Mac E. Doobage
= Cult of Ray =
503 Posts |
Posted - 01/31/2006 : 22:32:40
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quote:
Originally posted by VoVat
So I was actually partially right?
I'm scared, too.
"Reunion? Shit union!"
no |
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Monsieur
* Dog in the Sand *
France
1688 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2006 : 01:33:40
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So now we understand everything except this part of the song:
"In the evening I want my coffee
And in the morning I want my dope"
Is it there just to fit the rhyme (pope-dope)?
The rhymes of the song in general are pretty poor, I would say. Especially coming from a man who made "potlach" rhyme with "sasquatch".
The song pretty much stays focused on topic, there are two metaphors (the classical "wine as a river" and taking the (translated) name litteraly - "the house"). Plus one nice part where he addresses the wine directly - this part pretty much saves the lyrics.
So basically Frank displays a couple of his usual tricks - including one little obscure reference (13 kisses). All packed in a nice, short and warm format. The know-how of one of the world's best songwriters.
I will show you fear in a handful of dust |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6214 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2006 : 02:35:17
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and the begining of the song sounds just like 'Ballad of a Thin Man'
But still, that recording. Lovely production, SMYT is his best arranged album
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God save the Noisies |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6214 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2006 : 02:37:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Carl
The piano on this reminds me of Dylan's Ballad Of A Thin Man!
pas de dutchie!
Carl said it before apparently
sorry Carl
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God save the Noisies |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2006 : 06:30:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Monsieur
So now we understand everything except this part of the song:
"In the evening I want my coffee
And in the morning I want my dope"
Is it there just to fit the rhyme (pope-dope)?
The rhymes of the song in general are pretty poor, I would say. Especially coming from a man who made "potlach" rhyme with "sasquatch".
The song pretty much stays focused on topic, there are two metaphors (the classical "wine as a river" and taking the (translated) name litteraly - "the house"). Plus one nice part where he addresses the wine directly - this part pretty much saves the lyrics.
So basically Frank displays a couple of his usual tricks - including one little obscure reference (13 kisses). All packed in a nice, short and warm format. The know-how of one of the world's best songwriters.
I will show you fear in a handful of dust
Well, the song is about escapism, no? Swimming in the New House of the Pope = getting smashed. Dope = another way of doing the same thing, but for a different time of day/stage of depression.
Is it really "In the evening"? I thought it was night...
"If we hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominos will fall like a house of cards. Checkmate." |
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Carl
- A 'Fifth' Catholic -
Ireland
11546 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2006 : 03:20:32
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quote:
Originally posted by billgoodman
quote:
Originally posted by Carl
The piano on this reminds me of Dylan's Ballad Of A Thin Man!
pas de dutchie!
Carl said it before apparently
sorry Carl
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God save the Noisies
No need to apologise, my goodman!
Great minds think alike!
pas de dutchie! |
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Topic |
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Song db: SMYT - New House Of The Pope
