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dayanara
* Dog in the Sand *
Australia
1811 Posts |
 Posted - 01/11/2005 : 18:14:09
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I was flipping through the CD mix swap topics just now, and it occurred to me I'd never be able to participate because I'm not a terribly prolific rock listener and the only genre of music I'm really well versed in is classical. Orchestral and string chamber specifically, I suppose. I know Frank has mentioned in several interviews recently that he's gotten into classical, and I've been very pleased with the examples he's been giving; Faure, Liszt, etc. It makes me so happy to hear people go beyond those generic "Classical Hits" compilations. There is just a vast wealth of amazing music out there waiting to be discovered, but you'd never know from listening to one of those damn things. Hindemith's Symphonic Metamorphosis is 10 billion times cooler than the opening movement of Beethoven's 5th symphony, but which one has everyone heard over and over. It just ain't right!
Anyone one else a fan? I'm interested to learn what kind of stuff you guys are listening to, as my tastes always fell along the lines of "what's fun to play."
If you really want to know, look in the Frank |
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Broken Face
-= Forum Pistolero =-
USA
5157 Posts |
Posted - 01/11/2005 : 19:56:11
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i'd love to learn more about classical music - teach me teacher!
-Brian
If you move I shoots!
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Sir Rockabye
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1158 Posts |
Posted - 01/11/2005 : 20:28:17
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I'm with Brian, its a topic that I know so many are very well versed in, and I've always had an interest in learning about it.
I will never say the word procrastinate again, I'll never see myself in the mirror with my eyes closed. |
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Daisy Girl
~ Abstract Brain ~
Belize
5305 Posts |
Posted - 01/11/2005 : 21:06:23
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I've forgotten alot about classical. I would listen to it studying and going to sleep. I guess I would say Bach is my favorite. The Brandenburg Concertos, prob being my most fave of that. 
It's also really neat hearing about artists histories. Tchaikovsky, who I really like too had a very interesting personal live and was shaped by being gay... a very interesting life. |
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dayanara
* Dog in the Sand *
Australia
1811 Posts |
Posted - 01/11/2005 : 21:40:22
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What are you guys interested in learning? It's kind of like saying, "Teach me about rock music" if rock music had been around for 400+ years. I guess I could come up with a recommended listening list. Looking for anything in particular?
The third Brandenburg concerto was the very first piece I ever played with an orchestra, Bach is great for beginners. Most of the "famous" dead composers would be considered punk if they were around today, probably because an alarmingly high percentage suffered from bipolar disorder and substance abuse. Mozart was the Courtney Love of his day. Robert Schumann tried to kill himself by jumping into the Rhine River, and eventually starved himself to death in an insane asylum. While all this was going on, Brahms ran off with his wife Clara, also a famous composer/pianist. And as Daisy mentioned, not only was Tchaikovsky gay, but he liked little boys. Any Leonard Bernstein biography will be the most salacious thing you'll ever read.
It cracks me up because most people associate classical music with boring, stodgy old folks who sit around in slippers smoking their pipes. Some of the most outrageous, bizarro people I've ever met have been really famous classical musicians.
If you really want to know, look in the Frank |
Edited by - dayanara on 01/11/2005 21:43:17 |
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whoreatthedoor
> Teenager of the Year <
Spain
2873 Posts |
Posted - 01/11/2005 : 23:43:41
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I like Wagner. Is he cool?
The violet, the lily and the pink but those I refused all three |
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dayanara
* Dog in the Sand *
Australia
1811 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 00:02:14
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Wagner is too cool for school. People get all upset and accuse him of being a nazi because Hitler liked his music, I believe he's still banned in Israel. The Ring Cycle is probably the most ambitious piece of music ever written. It has Frank written all over it - rampant incest, mutilation, norse mythology, angry gods kicking ass. If you ever get a chance to see this live - DO IT. Your mind will be blown. Just bring your Ritalin, because the whole thing is about 20 hours long.
If you really want to know, look in the Frank |
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n/a
deleted
4109 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 00:10:36
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I would like to like classical music, my husband likes a lot, but I don't know what's wrong with me because classical music in some cases makes me nervous and in other cases makes me very sad.
Do you have any advise for me dayanara? Where should I start?
Purify the colors, purify my mind,
and spread the ashes of the colors
over this heart of mine!
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whoreatthedoor
> Teenager of the Year <
Spain
2873 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 00:44:51
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quote:
Originally posted by dayanara
Wagner is too cool for school. People get all upset and accuse him of being a nazi because Hitler liked his music, I believe he's still banned in Israel. The Ring Cycle is probably the most ambitious piece of music ever written. It has Frank written all over it - rampant incest, mutilation, norse mythology, angry gods kicking ass. If you ever get a chance to see this live - DO IT. Your mind will be blown. Just bring your Ritalin, because the whole thing is about 20 hours long.
If you really want to know, look in the Frank
I must say something about classical. I like it best in opera versions, with a storyline, make-up, wardrobe, and even visual effects. I know is music what matters, but it's easy for me to understand it in a visual play.
The Hitler's thing is sad, although logical in a certain way. I hope some day Jewish people could enjoy it.
Oh! Forgot to add "The magic flute" Papageno's aria is brilliant. The best one for beginners, I guess. Or Verdi. Oh, fuck! Seems like I love this damn music!
The violet, the lily and the pink but those I refused all three |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 02:26:50
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I really like Glen Gould doing Bach´s Goldberg Variations. You can hear him muttering to himself over and under it.
--
Democracy is the unwiped ass of a devilish con game. |
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Cheeseman1000
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Iceland
8201 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 03:57:52
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I definitely like a lot of classical music - I'm how you would say, 'versed'. I've studied piano since the age of small, and I've really learnt to appreciate music by studying it at school.
I absolutely love Wagner, although my favourite is not the Ring, but Tristan und Isolde. You can get a distillation of this by finding the prelude, its only about 10-15 minutes so its a much easier listen. Its absolutely beautiful, and one of those occasions where studying the music helps you appreciate it.
I don't listen to as much as I should now, but I also enjoy Beethoven and some of the later Romantics, and also more modern composers such as Messiaen and even Michael Nyman and Philip Glass.
It's an area I'm always looking to improve my knowledge in, though, so... Hindemith you say?
I take it you're a pianist dayanara?
And if a double-decker bus
Crashes into us
To die by your side
Well, the pleasure and the privilege is mine. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 04:14:28
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People accuse Wagner of being a Nazi because he and Hitler shared the same views on people who weren´t of their genetic code. The Ring: Aryan superman tromping about a world stage for a considerable length...so you see right there. Although I do find it funny that it is banned in Rothschildland, considering Mahler´s studies with Wagner were funded by Albert de Rothschild.
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Democracy is the unwiped ass of a devilish con game. |
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Cheeseman1000
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Iceland
8201 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 04:15:45
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Yeah, I think Wagner's anti-semitism was pretty well documented, by himself even. It's a shame because I really like the music.
And if a double-decker bus
Crashes into us
To die by your side
Well, the pleasure and the privilege is mine. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 04:31:59
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Twas more than antisemitism, it was anyone not of ahem royal blood. And anyway, antisemitism doesn´t mean antiJew, it actually means antiArab (!).
--
Democracy is the unwiped ass of a devilish con game. |
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n/a
deleted
4109 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 05:30:31
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Dayanara, I think the idea of the game is that everyone can make a mix with the music that they like, to share your taste with the others, you could participate and get some of us listening to classical music.
I think that would be great!
Purify the colors, purify my mind,
and spread the ashes of the colors
over this heart of mine!
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whoreatthedoor
> Teenager of the Year <
Spain
2873 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 05:47:42
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His friendship with Nietzsche didn't help.
The violet, the lily and the pink but those I refused all three |
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Broken Face
-= Forum Pistolero =-
USA
5157 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 06:14:36
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dayanara, i already like debussy a great deal, i dig bach, and i like wagner. i played in orchestras when i was in high school, so i know some of the typical orchestral fare, but haven't heard any of the more, how do i put this, non-superstar composers. so yeah, a listening list would be fantastic for me. or, if you'd rather do a swap, i could make you a "rock" sampler.
-Brian
If you move I shoots!
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11690 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 06:29:04
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I went through about five years where I'd gotten tired of the oldies, didn't like music currently being made (for radio) and hadn't heard about indie. So my sole genre turned to classical and contemporary classical (yeah, I know) music.
I haven't heard that track, but there's a lot more to Beethoven's Fifth than the well known opening movement, and I think the song (and many of Beethoven's works) became famous for good reason. As did many others of the classics generally seen on compilations.
That said, it is nice to see people listen beyond that, and I do agree. I've never heard of Hindemith, but I do enjoy Liszt, the occasional Rachminoff, of couse, Beethoven, Mozart, Bach, Vivaldi, Wagner, and Tchaichovsky (damned if I can spell it). As far as contemporary, my favourite musician, right up there with Frank Black himself, is John Williams. Not classical, perhaps, but symphonic and, particularly earlier on, very well written.
 "Join the Cult of Frank 2.0 / And you'll be enlightened (free for 1.x members)" |
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The Holiday Son
= Quote Accumulator =
France
2023 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 07:43:47
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I would say John Williams write classical music.
I also like Messiaen and Stravinsky, but to be honest I don't listen to them much.
Though I listen to John Williams quite often. |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11690 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 08:34:23
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Yeah, I listen to far more John Williams than anything else. It's a good starting point for someone just getting interested in classical music too, in that it's accessible and still quite good.
"Join the Cult of Frank 2.0 / And you'll be enlightened (free for 1.x members)" |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 09:12:39
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Can't honestly say I know too much on this subject. I like what I've heard of Bach and I think that Pachelbel, 'Canon In D Major' is one of the most beautiful pieces of music ever written. If anyone wants to recommend anything to me then I would be grateful. See what I can get off Limewire for now.
I spent a lifespan with no cellmate |
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dayanara
* Dog in the Sand *
Australia
1811 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 09:39:39
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Wagner's views were typical of men of his standing and background at the time and as Newo mentioned, he was anti-"anyone but me." Daniel Barenboim, who is an Israeli conductor and the preeminent Wagner authority, played some Wagner instrumentals, I believe from Tristan, recently in Tel Aviv. It was an encore and not listed on the program. Before beginning he announced the selection and invited anyone who did not wish to hear it to leave. Very few people left and he was given a standing ovation. Barenboim's a pretty controversial guy over there, he was close friends with Edward Said, but I admire what he's doing with the West-Eastern Divan Orchestra where young Israeli and Palestinian musicians come together to play in the spirit of peace.
Here's a rough list off the top of my head. As I said before, my favorites are always ones I like to play, and as you can see, I'm seriously lacking in the non-string/vocal department and heavily leaning in the romantic/early 20th century. This is not meant to be an overview or broad representation of the different periods and there's nothing terribly obscure here, but I think everything on the list is must-listen. I put recommended recordings on those I thought were the definitive versions. I also tried to include some lesser known works by the major composers. If you're not real familiar with good orchestras vs. bad orchestras it's usually best to stick with big cities (London, Berlin, Paris, New York, Chicago, Philly, etc).
ORCHESTRAL
Hindemith: Symphonic Metamporphosis - Cleveland/Szell
Elgar: String Serenade - English Chamber Orchestra/Barenboim
Mahler: Symphony No. 1 "Titan" - Berlin Phil/Abbado
Faure: Pelleas et Melisande - Montreal/Dutoit. Aside from being absolutely heartbreaking, this includes the Sicilienne that we should all hope and pray makes its way onto the post-Honeycomb FB release. I almost wet my pants when he said they'd been working on that. I always tear up when Melisande's soul ascends to heaven in the last movement. Debussy also has a great Pelleas.
Shostakovich: Symphony No. 5 - my absolute favorite piece of music to listen to/play. It's insane, meaty, and very Russian sounding. A hearty musical meal.
Berlioz: Symphony Fantastique, Harold in Italy. Acid trips set to music. Berlioz was a God in my house growing up, my mother is a member of the Berlioz society in France and went over for the 200th aniversary of his birth last year. I just checked and I have 8 different versions of Harold right now.
Stravinsky: Le Sacre du Printemps - Birmingham/Rattle. Riot inducing, needs no explanation. Petrushka is also very good.
Bach: Transcriptions - Stokowski. An oldy but a goody, lots of piano and organ pieces performed by a full orchestra.
Richard Strauss: anything and everything, but the tone poems (Don Juan, Don Quixote, etc) are stand-outs, as are the Four Last Songs. Absolutely not to be confused with Johann Strauss or any of the other 45 Strauss'.
Britten: The Young Person's Guide to the Orchestra. With or without narration, this is big fun.
Bruckner: Symphony No. 7 in E - Barenboim is the king of Bruckner, anything he conducts is wonderful.
Prokofiev: Classical Symphony
PDQ Bach: 1712 Overture and other Musical Assaults - the more you know about music the more hilarious this will be.
SOLOIST w/ORCHESTRA
Elgar: Cello Concerto in E minor - Jacqueline duPre, cello. This recording made me want to be a musician. Music to kill yourself to. Has to be duPre.
Beethoven: Piano Concerto no. 5 - Emanuel Ax, piano.
Sibelius: Violin Concerto in D minor - Anne-Sophie Mutter, violin
Mozart: Sinfonia Concertante for Violin and Viola - anything with Pinchas Zuckerman on viola is gold.
Bruch: Kol Nidrei for Cello and Orchestra
Hummel: Trumpet Concerto in E flat Major
Tavener: The Protecting Veil - Isserlis, cello
SOLO
Bach: Unaccompanied Cello Suites - Mstislav Rostropovich, cello
Liszt: Transcendental Etudes - Evgeny Kissin, piano
Paganini: Caprices - Midori, violin
Chopin: Etudes, Nocturnes - Ashkenazy, Rubinstein and Van Cliburn have good versions.
CHAMBER ENSEMBLE
Mendelssohn: Octet
Beethoven: Piano Trio in D "Ghost" op. 70 No. 2- Barenboim, Zuckerman, duPre
Mozart: Clarinet Quintet k.581
Bloch: Baal Shem for violin and piano
Dvorak: String Quintet for 2 violins, viola, cello, and double bass in G major. I really love this one.
Schubert: String Quintet for 2 violins, viola and 2 cellos in C major. Emerson Quartet/Rostropovich
CHORAL
Mendelssohn: Elijah - Atlanta Symphony/Shaw have a good version sung in english instead of german. Elijah has a lot of "god is pissed" hellfire and brimstone stuff.
Beethoven: Choral Fantasy
Verdi: Requiem - Chicago/Solti Blow the speakers out of the room.
Mozart: Requiem A must-have
Bach: Mass in B minor
Orff: Carmina Burana. Everyone knows the Fortuna, but the rest of it s just as weird, if not weirder. Perverted stuff sung in Latin.
Britten: War Requiem - New York Phil/Masur
OPERA
Berg: Wozzeck. Wozzeck, a poor soldier, after suffering through wacky medical experiments such as only eating cheese and beans and not urinating for days, goes insane and kills his lover and then drowns while throwing the murder weapon into a lake of blood. This opera rules.
Richard Strauss: anything and everything, but Salome is a stand out. Vienna Phil w/Terfel and Dohnanyi conducting is a goody.
Wagner: We've already talked about the Ring and Tristan, check out Lohengrin and Parsifal.
Gounod: Faust. If you like it check out his Romeo et Juliette.
Massenet: Herodiade - San Francisco/Domingo/Fleming/Gergiev
Berlioz: Les Troyens
Sorry it's so long. I guess I have a hard time letting go... but please feel free to add on to it! you know I could never really get into Glass and the like, I'm a sucker for big lush strings and fat brass. Maybe I'll have to check him out again. Suggestion on where to begin?
If you really want to know, look in the Frank |
Edited by - dayanara on 01/12/2005 09:42:34 |
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remig
* Dog in the Sand *
France
1734 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 10:09:03
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Classical music is for old boring people.
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Monsieur
* Dog in the Sand *
France
1688 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 11:07:27
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quote:
Originally posted by remig
Classical music is for old boring people.
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[
Well you should check out Wagner, this guy kicks ass!
I was 18 years old when for the first time in my life I was interested in an opera. Most of people who go to the opera do it because it is a statement about their cultural or social background, but I really enjoyed it like I enjoyed Frank or the Pixies.
Actually, the Ring (I also like Lohengrin very much) is very similar to the Pixies in many ways, as somebody already mentioned. And I really don't give a fuck about the fact that Wagner was an asshole in his private life. Or even the fact that it might affect his work. I already mentioned it in a thread about Leni Riefenstahl, it's the use of the work of art that can be immoral, art is beyond good and evil.
I will show you fear in a handful of dust |
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Cheeseman1000
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Iceland
8201 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 14:25:40
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it also struck me to recommend some of Beethoven's later piano sonatas. These are waaaay ahead of their time, and just beautiful.
I also enjoy impressionist composers such as Debussy and Ravel, especially to play.
And if a double-decker bus
Crashes into us
To die by your side
Well, the pleasure and the privilege is mine. |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 14:31:25
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To kick the Wagner horse again, I don´t see anything in terms of good and evil, we´re always going to have conflict in your hearts if we do. I dont think anyone is good or evil, we just are. It´s just that there´s plenty of artists who don´t spend most of their time canvassing for a master race and I´m going to spend more of my time listening to them just in case they have a more generous, unified vision to share.
--
Democracy is the unwiped ass of a devilish con game. |
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n/a
deleted
4894 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 15:25:51
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yeah, my housemate is always saying 'sometimes wankers make good music' but i'm still not going to listen to the darkness damn it
Frank Black ate my hamster |
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NimrodsSon
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1938 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 17:56:40
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Well, I actually hate classical music as far as what actual classical music in the literal meaning of the term is, but I love Bach (it's like eighteenth century psychedelic music) as well as several more modern composers, such as Rachmaninov, Stravinsky, and Gershwin. I love Franck's organ music (great stuff and fun to play) and I also love playing Gigout on the organ and of course Bach on piano and organ.
ˇViva los Católicos! |
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i fought pirahnas
- FB Fan -
USA
21 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 18:00:21
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| Have you heard Saint-Saens Organ Symphony? It's gorgeous. The first time I heard it live was in an old Catholic church with a huge pipe organ that wrapped all the way around the building. The floor shook whenever the soloist played, it was quite an experience. I'm always very impressed with organ players. I'm not even coordinated enough to play piano, let alone mess with the extra keyboards and foot pedals. |
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Broken Face
-= Forum Pistolero =-
USA
5157 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 18:23:56
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i have three organist friends and i am consistently impressed with their skills
-Brian
If you move I shoots!
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NimrodsSon
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1938 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 18:27:02
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No, I haven't heard it, but I'll be sure to check it out. I LLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVVVVVVVVVVVVVEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE the sound of a good pipe organ, ESPECIALLY playing on one. One of the most surreal experiences I've ever had was playing on an incredible sounding pipe organ at Northside Drive Baptist Church in Atlanta (as far as I'm concerned, pipe organs are the only thing churches are good for!). It really makes you feel like you are in control of the world. It gives you a huge sense of power. I highly reccommend it to anybody, even if you don't know how to play. Unfortunately they aren't exactly very compatible with houses (although I do know someone who had one built in his home, and he's not even very wealthy, mind you) so I have to stick with the Hammond most of the time.
Actually, it's not as difficult as it appears to play the pedals. Maybe at first, but you get used to it pretty fast, speaking as someone who's been playing the piano for ten years and just took up organ about a year ago. And the extra keyboards really don't make much of a difference, only that one hand might be a little higher up than another at different points in a song.
ˇViva los Católicos! |
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Daisy Girl
~ Abstract Brain ~
Belize
5305 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2005 : 21:41:45
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WOW D thanks so much for all the time you have put into this. It's going to be very cool exporing some of this.
I had no idea that T. liked litte boys vs. men. eeeewwww. What I find disturbing is that there was a guest conductor that had studied a lot of his life and he didn't mention it. He was openly gay and I suspect looking for an example to hold up for the gay community. He either didn't know about (which I find hard to believe) or ignored it.
Actually, I didn't know you play. What instrument do you play? Do you still preform? I thought you were a nurse. Do you do both. Sorry for all the q's... just curious.
Thanks again for all the time you are putting into hooking us up! |
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ObfuscateByWill
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1887 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2005 : 11:21:42
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I'm not much of a classical listener.
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I do really like Max Richter's "Memoryhouse" and his 2004 album, "The Blue Notebooks."
Completely in love with Alvin Lucier. Incredible stuff!
-edit
Oh, I forgot another favorite. Philip Glass. I know he's a bit over-rated, but c'mon ..could you have done Koyannisqatsi?
 Take a bite of the chocolate coffin. |
Edited by - ObfuscateByWill on 01/13/2005 11:27:34 |
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astrology
= Cult of Ray =
Saint Lucia
252 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2005 : 12:06:56
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umm
heard twice a real cathedral organ.. first in Palsencia and later in Santiago de Compostela.. the guy was playing Bach's toccata et fuga-...
lately in sevilla there were a lot of commies playing classical in the streets.. its nice
Now i am away and mainly brought my classical CDs , bits and pieces.. stravisky, debussy, chopin, malher..at this moment im listening Chopin nocturnes..
I'm a pistolero, i'm not shakin in my boots
I'm the ruler of this moon, if u move I shoots
the bad thing about talkin to inanimate things starts when they start complainin bout it |
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Classical Music
