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Cheeseman1000
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Iceland
8201 Posts |
 Posted - 11/17/2004 : 15:02:44
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Before I start, this is not neccessarily directed at the Spanish in general, particularly not those on this forum.
Tonight, the England vs Spain football match left me fuming. OK, our midfield may as well have stayed at home, our passsing was abysmal and the strikers didn't get a chance, but thats not what ticked me off.
Every time England's black players (Ashley Cole and Shaun Wright-Phillips) in particular) got the ball, a certain section of the crowd began monkey chants. I was utterly appalled. I didn't think anyone held this sort of attitude anymore, particularly not in an advanced, liberal country such as Spain.
It led one of the commentators to ask to be reminded what year we were in, and I fully see his point. It was, as John Motson said: "tiresome, unneccessary and completely out of order," and thats putting it very mildly indeed.
"You ever seen a man say goodbye to a shoe?"
"Yes, once..." |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 15:56:39
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That is simply disgusting simon.
__________
Godfather of nothing, ancesters of none.
Black glasses and feedback took my sense of fun.
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Dallas
= Cult of Ray =
USA
725 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 16:01:22
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Wow. That is surprising. That wouldnt even happen in the deep south in the US. Even though some people may want to, the stigma that attached to that line of thinking would get the people shouted down and kicked out of the event.
Is there no security in the stands or ushers? |
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Cheeseman1000
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Iceland
8201 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 16:04:08
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You'd think so, but I've been reading this week that this sort of attitude goes by reasonably unnoticed in Spain. I'd prefer to think this wasn't true.
I think in the UK, starting a chant like that at a match would be roughly equivalent to going into the ground with a swastika tatooed to your forehead.
"You ever seen a man say goodbye to a shoe?"
"Yes, once..." |
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n/a
deleted
4894 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 16:07:31
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It's ridiculous, racism makes me want to fucking puke, ridiculous.
Frank Black ate my hamster |
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mun chien andalusia
= Quote Accumulator =
Italy
2139 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 16:58:37
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unfortunately it's pretty common in italy too. "jew supporters-niger team" was a common chant of lazio's supporters against roma.
 join the cult of errol\and you can have a beer\without having to quit smoking
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n/a
deleted
4894 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 17:08:49
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is it meant to be malicious or is it just an ignorant chant?
Frank Black ate my hamster |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 22:44:31
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Are you serious? This is mind-blowing in a horrible, horrible way. This year is full of surprises re: the dark side of humanity.
 "Join the Cult of Frank 2.0 / And you'll be enlightened (free for 1.x members)" |
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whoreatthedoor
> Teenager of the Year <
Spain
2873 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 23:39:31
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It's isn't racism, it's just a stupid chant. It's a common attitude here to say the most horrible things to football players. They use to do it even when there are black players in their own team, which is particullarly ironic.
Caminar sobre las hojas del otoño es romántico y resbaladizo |
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cvanepps
= Cult of Ray =
USA
442 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 04:38:29
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That's terrible. Good Christ!
My sister lived in Budapest for three years and she told me many stories about how bad racism is in the eastern block. I realize Spain is not in the eastern block but it's symptomatic of an overt racism over there whereas stateside, it tends to be covert.
I know we have many many folks from Europe posting on this forum so if I'm wrong, please tell me.
-= It's not easy to kidnap a fat man =-
http://www.cvanepps.com |
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vilainde
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Niue
7443 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 04:53:19
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You can't say hooligans in football stadiums are representative of the European population. It's like saying Americans are racist because there are no black Nascar drivers.
I think here in France they usually fine the team whose supporters cause such trouble, but I don't know how it works in other countries.
Denis
"I believe in your perfect face..." |
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the tolerant
= Cult of Ray =
298 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 05:05:53
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England Under 21's got the same reception too the night before.
I think they're more than just chants, and even if they were just to rile, it's pretty mean shit what they spouting.
It must be hard to deal with, especially at the age of say 18 or 19. Footballers are outnumbered big time by the crowd so to here such hostility....
I know our fans can be yobs 'n' nobs, and we no angels, but it seems to always happen in certain parts of Europe whenever England play. And it's mass chanting too. Not just a small minority tucked in the corner of the lower tier of a stand. Coin Tossin' Racist Fools.
But this has been going on forever. We see our stars wearing their "Kick Racism Out Of Football" tees and doing their bit to promote the cause but they do it all the time. The message just doesn't get across. Well, to the ignorant anyway. |
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mun chien andalusia
= Quote Accumulator =
Italy
2139 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 06:18:36
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quote:
Originally posted by whoreatthedoor
It's isn't racism, it's just a stupid chant. It's a common attitude here to say the most horrible things to football players. They use to do it even when there are black players in their own team, which is particullarly ironic.
Caminar sobre las hojas del otoño es romántico y resbaladizo
it isn't just a stupid chant i'm afraid. many supporters are organized fascist groups even outside the stadium. they want to pass their message through football. another example is the lazio chant that praised "arkan the tiger" some years ago. what a serbian war criminal has to do with football? and bashing your own players is significant. why the hell would a supporter bash his own team? there are loads of similar examples. and they are not so innocent as they may seem.
join the cult of errol\and you can have a beer\without having to quit smoking
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Cheeseman1000
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Iceland
8201 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 06:21:28
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quote:
Originally posted by whoreatthedoor
It's isn't racism
Sorry, I have to disagree - its horribly racist to direct offensive chants at people because of the colour of their skin.
I think in a lot of places it stems from ignorance - my flatmates girlfriend is Bulgarian and she said when she first arrived at the coach station she was shocked because she'd never seen a black person before.
I'm not sure what the cultural mix is like in Spain - from what I've heard its a lot less diverse than the UK or France, but I couldn't say for sure.
PS Whore etc., I'd just like to say I'm commenting on the fans not you guys, please don't misunderstand me.
"You ever seen a man say goodbye to a shoe?"
"Yes, once..." |
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n/a
deleted
4894 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 06:40:20
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Ugh it is horrible, really horrible. A Hindu friend of mine knocked back this guy at her last university who came onto her and everytime he saw her after that he'd yell racist abuse at her..
(However... this guy made the mistake once of calling her a fucking paki outside the meeting place for an asian lads society, just as it broke up.... she said to him "do you realise where you are?" this guy turned around and saw this huge group of angry lads growling at him and she added "If I were you, I would run now"... run he did, and not fast enough he was)
Frank Black ate my hamster |
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whoreatthedoor
> Teenager of the Year <
Spain
2873 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 08:25:47
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quote:
Originally posted by mun chien andalusia
it isn't just a stupid chant i'm afraid. many supporters are organized fascist groups even outside the stadium. they want to pass their message through football. another example is the lazio chant that praised "arkan the tiger" some years ago. what a serbian war criminal has to do with football? and bashing your own players is significant. why the hell would a supporter bash his own team? there are loads of similar examples. and they are not so innocent as they may seem.
join the cult of errol\and you can have a beer\without having to quit smoking
But we were talking about the general chants, not only a small group. I know that some fascist bands use sports because they need a reason to get into a fight. There are motherfuckers everywhere.
Caminar sobre las hojas del otoño es romántico y resbaladizo |
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whoreatthedoor
> Teenager of the Year <
Spain
2873 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 08:44:41
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I'm not trying to apologize them. You can say that spanish people is racist, and it's partially true, but you can't base your opinion on a football match, because a football match isn't real life. I've seen the most lovely people shouting horrible things to a player who had cancer. It isn't well done, but it happens. I've been in a lot of football games, so I know what I'm talking about.
Also I remember seeing black guys doing the same thing to a black player. In general it's plain stupidness and not real hatred. After all, sports are a legal substitute for war.
PS: It's hard to talk about these things in a foreign language without being misunderstood, so I quit.
Caminar sobre las hojas del otoño es romántico y resbaladizo |
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mun chien andalusia
= Quote Accumulator =
Italy
2139 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 08:55:47
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of course i was not talking about the spanish (or italian for that matter) people in general. i was just making a point on what kind of people go to the stadium nowadays. i love football but i hate to shout, that's why i quit going to the stadium. i only go to champions league games everynow and then nowadays. fear of uefa punishment shuts many fuckheads up and permits to enjoy the game.
join the cult of errol\and you can have a beer\without having to quit smoking
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bazza
* Dog in the Sand *
Ireland
1439 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 10:48:42
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personally if i was either ashley cole or shaun wright phillips i would have left the pitch. it was awful - but its always going to be a minority who do things like that.
Employee of the month is a good example of how somebody can be both a winner and a loser at the same time. |
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astrology
= Cult of Ray =
Saint Lucia
252 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 14:52:55
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football fans are mostly mononeuronal beings..
right wing guys are mainly racists but with the other hand are profiting on inmigrant laborwhat underlies in this is that spaish workin class folks instead of using thei educational advantage normaly are unskilled workers who fear the inmi grants as concurrenc
note i live in a workin class neighbohood in sevilla and have morrocans africans and latin american people living here and we get along well
in catalonia many people took inmigrants with them when voting as a way of showing they should have same rights..
I'm a pistolero, i'm not shakin in my boots
I'm the ruler of this moon, if u move I shoots
the bad thing about talkin to inanimate things starts when they start complainin bout it |
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darwin
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
5454 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 20:35:14
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quote:
Originally posted by vilainde
You can't say hooligans in football stadiums are representative of the European population. It's like saying Americans are racist because there are no black Nascar drivers.
I think here in France they usually fine the team whose supporters cause such trouble, but I don't know how it works in other countries.
Denis
"I believe in your perfect face..."
Lester Webb - NASCAR Truck Series
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mun chien andalusia
= Quote Accumulator =
Italy
2139 Posts |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6213 Posts |
Posted - 11/19/2004 : 07:39:31
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Oh yeah throwing bananas at black players
it happens
it's repulsive
In Holland there's a tradition of shouting the most disguisting things
even about the girlfriends or wives of players
think in the line of hookers, jews, and mostly in the combination with cancer or HIV
 "I joined the cult of Jon Tiven/Bye!" |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 12/23/2004 : 10:39:01
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quote:
Originally posted by mun chien andalusia
PS: at least the spanish apologised...
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,27-1365730,00.html
join the cult of errol\and you can have a beer\without having to quit smoking
Their coach wasn't so apologetic though, nor were certain sections of their press.
Sadly this has now crept back into the English game, albeit with a very very small minority (two or three at a game).
Help me! He keeps making me post!
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 12/23/2004 : 17:11:24
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Monkey chants? Par for course. I would hardly have thought watching twentytwo adults trying to put an inflated piece of leather inside a net was something that increases neural activity anyway. Sorry guys, playing sports fine, passively watching them is for morons.
--
Maze rats dreamed of mazes, according to the latest studies. Maze rat scientists dreamed of rats. I was dreaming of cheese. |
Edited by - Newo on 12/23/2004 18:26:15 |
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whoreatthedoor
> Teenager of the Year <
Spain
2873 Posts |
Posted - 12/23/2004 : 17:17:33
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"Panem et circenses", they said.
Though I prefer to watch wild beasts devouring christians.
Christians or whatever.
Caminar sobre las hojas del otoño es romántico y resbaladizo |
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Newo
~ Abstract Brain ~
Spain
2674 Posts |
Posted - 12/23/2004 : 17:27:32
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Imagine all the Romans that sat around on their behinds reading the sports news carved on stone tablets. Games were there partly to distract them from real life under the asskicking financial systems of interest and usury that they lived with and, uh, we still live with. I mean, go team.
--
Maze rats dreamed of mazes, according to the latest studies. Maze rat scientists dreamed of rats. I was dreaming of cheese. |
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whoreatthedoor
> Teenager of the Year <
Spain
2873 Posts |
Posted - 12/23/2004 : 17:37:15
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A funny vision, isn't it?
There wasn't any television, after all.
Caminar sobre las hojas del otoño es romántico y resbaladizo |
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Homers_pet_monkey
= Official forum monkey =
United Kingdom
17125 Posts |
Posted - 12/27/2004 : 11:10:18
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quote:
Originally posted by whoreatthedoor
"Panem et circenses", they said.
Though I prefer to watch wild beasts devouring christians.
Christians or whatever.
Caminar sobre las hojas del otoño es romántico y resbaladizo
Pah! As Newo says, I prefer to actually participate in the devouring of Christians, passively watching is for morons.
Help me! He keeps making me post!
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"International Friendly"
