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TOTIPOTENT
- Master of Differentiation -
USA
247 Posts |
 Posted - 09/20/2003 : 06:08:06
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... of providing financial support for necessities - For all purposes lets say a college education? In other words, is it the student's or the parent's responsibility to provide income for higher education? Discuss...
 "I joined the Cult of Frank / 'Cause Dean promised me World Domination" |
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El Barto
= Song DB Master =
USA
4020 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2003 : 09:33:01
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It's the parent's responsibility until their child is 23, when they are no longer obligated by law to pay for their child's college. If a student under the age of 23 applies for financial aid, they still take the student's parents' income into consideration. So if your parents make a combined income of like, $100,000, you're not getting much or anything from financial aid.
 "I joined the Cult of Frank / Did anyone else have to give up their first born?" |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2003 : 09:51:12
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I think that there's no number, it's the parents responsibility to help out their children however old. Sometimes that might mean money, sometimes it might mean withholding money. Lots of people need to be weened into adulthood, and as long as it's in the best interests of the child, that's really the point. I think it would be selfish to say, "Well, you're __, and you really need our help, and we have the means to help you, but that's tough."
But what do I know? I just know that someday I'd hope to be able to help my kids get as good a start on the world as possible, whatever that may mean.
 "Join the Cult of Frank / And you'll be enlightened" |
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Dallas
= Cult of Ray =
USA
725 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2003 : 11:48:44
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Legally its 18. Morally and ethically most societies would say forever. Or at least until that time that the child morally and ethically will be required to care for the aging parent.
Parents are never req'd by law to pay for a childs education. I believe that if the parents do not claim the child as a dependant, the child can seek financial assistance and loans through his/her own accord. I havent been in school for awhile (oh no, I'm closer to being the parent in this relationship than the student by a whisker!) so I could be wrong. |
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glacial906
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1738 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2003 : 12:43:43
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I used to get very frustrated because before my wife and I got married and had a child, on my application for financial aid I had to claim one of them as though I lived with them, which limited the amount of money I could get. Neither one of them make much money, and they've been divorced for the past seven years, but I would put my dad down because he is still single and I wouldn't have to consider two people's combined income. I figured, if they were going to make it seem as though I lived with one of them, even though I didn't, I might as well lie in that situation.
I realize that that's a contingent they probably had to put into place because there are an awful lot of young people out there that fall into my category, of not having live with or recieved any sort of financial assistance from their parents for some time, and if they gave out financial aid to ALL those people they'd break the bank. At least, that's what I assume. I finally got my break when I did get married, because then they could SOLELY consider my income and my wife's, which is pretty paltry compared to people with actual careers. (We both work in a restaurant.)
I suppose I should've been grateful because financial aid comes in the form of either loans or grants, and isn't like a "obligation" of the lenders to provide. But man, I was very resentful that the school MADE ME put that I lived w/ one of my parents, when I haven't for the past six years.
My parents provide money when they can, but it hasn't been very often, and I don't expect it. Maybe my relationship with them hasn't been that good for awhile, but ever since they've had their divorce, and the crap I've seen them go through, they've just seemed like regular people, not my "mom" and "dad" like most people consider their parents. I fully intend to not let this happen with my daughter, and I'm going to start saving for her college early. I might not be able to pay for it completely, but I figure something's better than nothing. I'll do the same for the next kid, too. If I could, I would definitely pay for all of it, who knows, maybe I'll be able to one day, but if I can't, I don't think my kids should hold it against me or consider me a bad parent. I don't consider my own parents like that, even with the little bit they have been able to help me with.
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
Douglas Adams |
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I Punch Babies
- FB Fan -
4 Posts |
Posted - 09/21/2003 : 01:23:52
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BOTH...
Think about it...I would rather take on challenges myself and not "depend" on what I shouldn't need if I can help it.
If a parent decides to fund his/her/their student's education, I think they should ensure that the student is well aware that this funding is only a priviledge. And can be withdrawn at any moment.
That way, the chances of the student taking "helping hands of life" for granted are lessened.
In the long run, don't you think it would be more beneficial for someone to work for what they need?
If a young student goes through college not worrying about where next semester's costs are coming from or where they'll get their books from, how much effort do you think they will put forth?
As opposed to a student who works him/herself for their own future?
As for a parent's responsibility, they should of course guide their son/daughter to do right from wrong, teach them good morals, ethics and so forth. But I also believe a good parent should put a load of responsibility on their son or daughter too.
Life is full of challenges, what is the best way to prepare someone for them?
---Like Mr. Burns said, "I'm a big boy now." |
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I Punch Babies
- FB Fan -
4 Posts |
Posted - 09/21/2003 : 01:26:59
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oh yeah.....
one more thing.
TOTIPOTENT's mom is hot!!!!! |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 09/21/2003 : 02:11:13
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Heh, that's an interesting name you've got there, my friend. And there is a lot to be said for having to work for it, I agree. In the end, I would say it's up to the child.
"Join the Cult of Frank / And you'll be enlightened" |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2003 : 11:21:55
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Answer to topic sentence,
God, I hope so!
Just kidding, I max out my kids' RESPs, painfully.
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2003 : 12:12:54
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I thought RESP's were not such a great idea...
"Join the Cult of Frank / And you'll be enlightened" |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2003 : 12:17:58
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| Of course they are a good idea, the government gives you free money, how often do they do that? |
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mereubu
= FB QuizMistress =
USA
2677 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2003 : 12:27:05
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I guess it just depends on the parents. My parents started saving $$ when we were all tiny to put us through college. In my case, they also helped pay for grad school. I realize that I'm very fortunate to have parents who had the foresight to do this and also the generosity. Hell, I'm 34, and they will still loan me money if I need it (as long as I pay it back on time.) I never thought, "Hey! They owe me this!" We just grew up w/the understanding that higher education was something that was important enough to them that they were willing to pay for it. My older siblings screwed around and didn't always take the whole college thing too seriously, but I knew what it meant to my parents and worked hard. I don't think that having it handed to you necessarily means that you won't appreciate it (although I have to say from my experience w/teaching college that there is certainly a portion of the student body that could benefit from having mummy & daddy throw them out on their asses for a while.)
My husband's parents weren't in a financial position to keep up w/his tuition, so basically, we got married b/c the financial aid laws suck. I don't know what the regs are like now, but in 1991, you had to either be 23 or have financially supported yourself since the age of 16 to be considered independent of your parents. Or be married. We got married, he got enough aid & loans to stay in school, and that was that.
We plan to help our child out in any way that we can until we drop dead. We're not ever going to make much, so we're limiting ourselves to one so that we can "do right" by her.
"I joined the Cult of Frank / And all I got was this lousy icon" |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2003 : 12:39:44
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Your parents sound awesome mere,
my dad drives an $80,000 Audi Quattro and I have about another $25,000 to pay off in loans. grrrrr.
But I can thank him for teaching me the value of a dollar. |
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glacial906
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1738 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2003 : 12:40:44
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Yeah, Mereubu, the law at least in Tennessee is that you have to either be 25 or married to qualify for financial aid based SOLELY on your own income.
My wife wants another child eventually, but not for awhile. I think two would be okay. Hell, one would be fine with me too, might retard that greying effect that's been going on with my hair.
I wonder if anyone ever tells your husband things like, "Oh just you wait till your daughter to become a teenager, and starts dating and smoking, and blah blah blah..." I finally just started telling people to let me enjoy her young years right now, when me and Sara are the coolest, most exciting people she knows, and our biggest problem with her is that she sometimes wakes up too early. Most of the people that say that do say it in jest, tho.
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
Douglas Adams |
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mereubu
= FB QuizMistress =
USA
2677 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2003 : 14:36:55
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Carolynanna: yeah, my dad no longer spreads much of his wealth around, but my mother would probably just lie down on the floor and let me walk all over her if I asked. Poor dear--she's so generous that I have to be really careful about not taking advantage of her kindness.
glacial: Just today, my daughter's preschool teacher, of all things, was saying, "She's so sweet and cooperative! Just pray that you can still stand her when she's a teenager." It seems as though someone warns me about the evils of adolescence about every other day. It's like, "Quit harshing the mellow and let me enjoy my child!" You're almost there, Carolyn, do you think your kid is going to transform overnight into a teenaged monster, or do you feel pretty good about it?
"I joined the Cult of Frank / And all I got was this lousy icon" |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2003 : 14:58:13
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I agree with the quit harshin the mellow. My son is 10 but really he is just a fantastic kid, no problems. Like I said its Bella I worry about. But with D being 10, the teens are just around the corner, but we're pretty open with him, and we're the youngest parents of a 10 year old around here so he thinks we're cool.
My mom always said that the easier the child the more difficult the teenager and vice versa, I guess we'll see. |
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darwin
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
5454 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2003 : 23:57:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Carolynanna
My mom always said that the easier the child the more difficult the teenager and vice versa, I guess we'll see.
That would mean my first will be no problem and the new one (4 months old) will be a disaster.
After my first kid, I couldn't understand how so many people survived being parents (and how the kids survived). She was so much work all day and all night. Now my new kid is a piece of cake. He sleeps, he's happy on the floor and in his bouncy seat, and he's easily comforted. You just can't predict which way those kids are going to go. |
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I Punch Babies
- FB Fan -
4 Posts |
Posted - 09/23/2003 : 06:37:34
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You have a 4 month old?
That's awesome...he's just a baby.
Can I meet him? I would like a picture. |
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PsychicTwin
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1772 Posts |
Posted - 09/23/2003 : 07:52:53
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If I had a 4-month old kid, I would be just a tad apprehensive about letting him or her meet someone who goes by the moniker "I Punch Babies". Then again, I don't have a kid and don't plan on having one in the near future, so what do i know?
http://psychictwin.tripod.com |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 09/23/2003 : 10:55:38
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| did I mention that that is 25 K in Canadian, still doesn't make it any better though, might as well be a million. |
Edited by - Carolynanna on 09/24/2003 09:27:30 |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 09/23/2003 : 10:56:47
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That's funny Darwin, mine are exactly opposite.
If I would've had the second one first, i think there would only be 1. |
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astrology
= Cult of Ray =
Saint Lucia
252 Posts |
Posted - 09/27/2003 : 19:16:05
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DEAR FRIENDS
I HAVER READ SOME OF THE TOPICS. IT IS AN INTERESTING QUESTION TO DISCUSS
FAMILY LINKS ARE FOREVER BUT YOU HAVE TO REPOND
MY FAMILY DID NOT TEACH ME, THEY TRAINED ME TO LOOK AFTER MYSELF, I HAD MORE TOOLS THAN TOYS AT HOME AND IT IS DIFFICULT TO ME TO SAY WHICH GAVE ME MORE FUN, I HAD PLENTY OF BOOKS, BUT ALSO I SAW MY MOM READ EVERYTIME SHE SAT.-
I MUST RECOGNICE THAT EVERYTHING WAS NOT OKAY BECAUSE I HAVE SEEN THINGS AT 5 HARD TO UNDERTAND BUT U ALLWAYS KNEW THAT MY PARENTS CARED FOR ME, FOR US
WE WERE FOUR BUT IF THEY DID NOT SOLVE ME SOMRE PROBLEM IT WAS BECAUSE I HAD TO SOLVE IT FOR MYSELF.
I THINK MY DAD WAS VERY HAPPY EVERYTIME HE REALIZED
HIS PLAYBOY MAGAZINES WERE NOT SO SECRET, BECAUSE HE KNEW WE WERE NOT LITTLE PERVERTS BUT WE WERE CURIOUS ABOUT LIFE,AND CURIOSITY IS THE KEY TO LEARNING AND TO KEEP ENERNAL YOUTH NO MATTER HOW OLD ARE YOU. I HAVE BEEN ON MY OWN SINCE I WAS 23 BURT BEFORE I ALWAYS LIKED TO EARN AN EXTRA MONEY BY MYSELF, AS ENGLISH TEACHER, TEH BEST PAYEMN FRONM A FRIEND WHO I COULD NOT CHARGE Y CLASSES BUT HE STOLE LED ZEP, PHYSICAL GRAFFITTI, HE KWEN VERY WELL IT IS STILL MY FAVOURITE RECORD.
BEST THING OF LIFE ARE FREE, BURT YOU NEED TO BE VERY WELL EDUCATED AND TRAINED TO ENJOY THEM.
THE SECRET. EACH ONE MUST FIND HIS/HER
SALUDOS
DAVID
SEVILLA
PD: THREE UNIVERSITIES TRIED TO CATCH ME, I WAS ALWAYS QUICKER, I WAS CHASING GIRLS AND YOU KNOW THEY MOVE AT SPEED OF LIGHT
get me to lemouria
and vaya usted con Dios.
I pay the gas but in euros please |
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Foucaults Dog
- FB Fan -
Ireland
124 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2003 : 07:23:15
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This is a moral or philosophical question, so can't really be addressed on legal grounds. Particularly, from a worldwide perspective, when say you compare the liberal democracy and laisez faire economy of the US to the social democracies and welfare state in much of Western Europe.
For example, regarding the college thing, I've just completed my honours degree with no assistance from my parents. Firstly, I'm an independent adult, and have regarded myself as such from the time I left home at 18.
Secondly, my folks couldn't afford to support me financially.
Luckily for me, I live in a society that (although it appears to be fading with the increasing liberalisation and americanisation characteristic of our conservative government)adheres to the rudiments of the welfare state. In accordance with the welfare state, all citizens are the responsibility (to some extent) of the nation as a whole... we live (or claim to live) in a society that is based on community rather than individualism (although I'm not convinced, as what sense of community that does exist seems to be fading fast).
So in getting back to the original question, it all comes down to the responsibilities that come with, and moreover the reasons for, having children.
As we as a species (well some of us) have evolved beyond purely instinctual breeding patterns, why do we have kids?
Do we want someone to look after us in old age?
Someone to mould as a mini me?
More and more people have kids just to put them in daycare for most of their childhood...why?
Do we want kids with minimal personal responsibility?
I am not being negative for its own sake, but am wrestling with these questions myself. |
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