| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Cheeseman1000 |
Posted - 06/04/2004 : 09:40:56
I don't know what everyone else calls it, but I'm referring to the act of throwing yourself around like a loon at gigs to the point where you're concentrating more on staying upright than listening to the music.
I tend to err on the side of watching the band, but then I'm possibly old before my time. I generally stand at the back of gigs to get the best sound, so I manage to stay out of the way of the (generally quite young) types who are moshing. At Brixton last night we were stood reasonably close to get a good view of David Lovering, and were caught up in the crowd once the band started playing. I didn't really mind a bit of jostling, but when you get big groups of big guys with no necks deliberately ramming you, it gets a little irritating. I'm quite a big guy so I was protecting the girl I came with (I'm such a gent), and trying not to give any ground to those around me. However, we just gave up in the end - I didn't have to fake screaming along with people stamping on my half-ingrowing toe.
Then again, I feel like a bit of a hypocrite saying all this, because when Tame was played I was leaping around myself. It was fun, but for some people this seems to be the main attraction for the gig - to get as bruised, sweaty and drunk as possible.
I think I'll go and dig out my pipe and slippers now.
 "Join The Cult Of Scientific Phenomenalism/And Receive A Free Vortex Cannon!" |
| 35 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| ispini tapaidh |
Posted - 06/10/2004 : 06:35:07
This thread has been a really good read. I'll definitely think a bit more in future before I lose it, although I will say that when I do spazz out, I'm really not thinking about anything but the music. It just kinda takes over, y'know? |
| mission_of_plumstead |
Posted - 06/10/2004 : 06:31:04
At brixton, I started off right down the front but moved back to enjoy the music more. It was a bit much for me as well, being a 5' 3" weakling! But still the highlight of the night for me was when head on started and everyone around just went wild.... |
| Ziggy |
Posted - 06/10/2004 : 02:01:56
Hehe... this is an interesting discussion.
Frank has actually stopped in the middle of a song to chastise people who are dancing too hard, cos they're distracting him. He said something like "You might think you're acting like my biggest fans, but think about my real fans are those down the front who you're pushing about". I hope I haven't taken that out of context.
Sure, it's great for any band to see people 'enjoying' the music, and applause and cheers no one could disagree with.
"Me and the chickens running in the street" |
| SpudBoy |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 20:52:02
Esquire.
*festoon* |
| VoVat |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 17:32:03
quote:
By the way, as someone mentioned earlier, it used to be called slam dancing. Who the hell thought of calling it moshing?
It was renamed in honor of its inventor, Charles Edward Mosh.
Cattle in Korea / They can really moo. |
| Cheeseman1000 |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 14:57:35
Thats cool. I have no problem with people dancing. I think one of the coolest crowd reactions I have seen was a few years ago at a punk festival in London, where about 10,000 people were skanking away to some random ska-punk band (Catch 22?). To see the whole crowd bobbing and weaving was ace.
However, my beef is with the people who forsake the main purpose of the gig (the music, duh...) just to leap around like crazy people.
 "It's a far cry from small boys in the park, jumpers for goalposts. Isn't it? Mmmmm. Marvellous." |
| The Calistanian |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 12:26:36
Being in a band myself, over the years I've enjoyed watching crowd reactions to songs. I dig it when people are out there having a great time dancing, as it is a natural rhythmic thing to do to music. I also really dig the people that are standing off to the side just watching and tapping their toes or bobbing their heads or whatever. I know they're really keyed in on the music and how it's performed. I've never had anybody extreme mosh at one of our gigs, but if they did, I would think it's kind of cool that he's trying to do that, but then I would think that he's being really stupid because it doesn't make any sense. Especially since I play in a polka band....just kidding.
Seriously though, the people that are intently watching, taking in everything, I appreciate the most.
1. I am a fsh with no i's.
2. You must be wearing Zubaz, 'cause you're daring to be different.
3. I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
| The Calistanian |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 12:17:24
quote:
Originally posted by guy_nolan
quote:
Originally posted by The Calistanian
I mean, slam dancing, extreme moshing, whatever you call it, is kind of disrespectful to The Man.
I feel the opposite way Calastanian. If you were up on that stage looking out into the crowd which would you prefer, everyone going absolutely mental and really getting something out of their night, or a hall full of people standing perfectly still with their arms crossed barely whispering along to the songs? Especially at a Pixies show where the music is so damn moshable, you know? It's not like I'd mosh to Show me your tears or something.
For ten thousand years he slept, his mind feeding on the nightmares of the weak. Now he has awakened. As the night turned crimson, the fire-blade shattered and his power died. Then, the slaughter began...
I guess I would choose something in between those two choices, which is where optimum appreciation for the music and song-crafting lies.
1. I am a fsh with no i's.
2. You must be wearing Zubaz, 'cause you're daring to be different.
3. I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
| guy_nolan |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 11:44:24
quote:
Originally posted by The Calistanian
I mean, slam dancing, extreme moshing, whatever you call it, is kind of disrespectful to The Man.
I feel the opposite way Calastanian. If you were up on that stage looking out into the crowd which would you prefer, everyone going absolutely mental and really getting something out of their night, or a hall full of people standing perfectly still with their arms crossed barely whispering along to the songs? Especially at a Pixies show where the music is so damn moshable, you know? It's not like I'd mosh to Show me your tears or something.
For ten thousand years he slept, his mind feeding on the nightmares of the weak. Now he has awakened. As the night turned crimson, the fire-blade shattered and his power died. Then, the slaughter began... |
| Cheeseman1000 |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 10:08:08
I suppose, thinking about it, its almost as bad being completely apathetic, especially combined with drink/drugs. I've been at a couple of gigs recently (specifically M83 and Silver Mount Zion), where people just talked over it, and really couldn't have appreciated the music. Especially with SMZ, you really need to listen to appreciate, right?
"It's a far cry from small boys in the park, jumpers for goalposts. Isn't it? Mmmmm. Marvellous." |
| gracie |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 09:39:10
I often wonder whether the extreme moshers (or slam dancers) actually enjoy the music or whether its just an excuse to get pissed and aggressive. Although because the Pixies sold out so quickly they must have made an effort to get the tickets and so must like the music.
When i was too young to go to gigs i had a very romatic idea that because someone liked the music i liked, Pixies, Frank, Sonic Youth whoever, they would be cool, intelligent etc. Boy, was i disappointed when i actually started going to gigs and there were loads of pissed pricks there. Sometimes it works out, like on this board but mostly it appears not. My expectations are too high i suppose.
|
| The Calistanian |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 08:49:35
Well, at every FB concert I've been to, I've had to try to avoid that "guy" who's whipping his head around like a crazed maniac, in no rhythm whatsoever. I have to spend most of the night keeping my teeth together and mouth shut so if I get cracked in the skull, I won't bite my tongue off. It's taken some enjoyment out of every show. But I guess my desire to be up front and center for FB and deal with that behavior exceeds my desire to get out of the situation. So I guess I can't complain a whole lot about it. Yet, is it too much to ask to be able to enjoy a FB concert with my full senses rather than be distracted by such inappropriate behavior? I mean, slam dancing, extreme moshing, whatever you call it, is kind of disrespectful to The Man.
1. I am a fsh with no i's.
2. You must be wearing Zubaz, 'cause you're daring to be different.
3. I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
| Carl |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 05:36:12
I've had some hairy moments in the past, getting crushed and knocked around. Moshing Cliches:There's always some 10 foot guy with Doc Martins diving onto everyone's heads, a tiny little rocker girl going nuts even though she's getting mashed, and someone who looses there glasses. There was an interview with Frank around the time of COR and he recalls a Black Flag gig he went to when he was younger, where a guy("Probably as big as I am now")flattened him stage-diving! |
| ispini tapaidh |
Posted - 06/09/2004 : 04:59:43
Hmmm. All this is making me consider my gig behaviour. I was pogo-ing at the FB& the C's in Vicar Street to practically everything. And singing along. I was very drunk though - had been at an after-work thing so I had started on the Wodka at 5. Kinda feel guilty now, although I'm not a big bloke so I don't think I caused too much damage.
My real problem is that when I get really pissed in a nightclub and they play anything rocky I try and start a bit of a mosh. Used to do it in Whelan's (wee rock club), and then started it in The Odeon (big trendy nightclub/bar/thing). Now I was only doing pushy-pushy moshing as opposed to slam dancing, but unfortunately other people started getting thrown out coz they reacted badly (including a couple of friends of mine).
Don't think the DJ minded - he seemed to slip in a few faster tunes, and finished with a certain Nivana song (after calls for an encore instigated by my drunken self).
So anyway, am I a twat? |
| n/a |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 16:14:40
jumping around at gigs is great. violence is unnecessary and like the hooliganism of the gigging world. I suffered a broken septum at a mansun gig for pete's sake! MANSUN! I got punched by a drunk at the pixies as well. which sucked.
someone check this threads vital signs...
tre-who-kills-threads |
| Cheeseman1000 |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 15:24:52
Yeah, the original thing I was referring to would be people barging round into people, having pretty much nothing to do with the music. Pogoing is fine by me, y'know, jumping up and down on the spot, I can sympathise with that, and even partake a little. I don't really consider it moshing.
By the way, as someone mentioned earlier, it used to be called slam dancing. Who the hell thought of calling it moshing?
"It's a far cry from small boys in the park, jumpers for goalposts. Isn't it? Mmmmm. Marvellous." |
| Homers_pet_monkey |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 14:40:31
Or I do. I'm just glad that people are OK with me jumping up and down. I was begining to worry. I only do it at some gigs though. The louder, faster ones.
Pixies!?!? Pixies!?!? Don't talk to me about the Pixies!!!.........OK, talk to me about the Pixies!!! |
| The Calistanian |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 14:32:24
I guess I've never considered that moshing. I've always considered where you're in danger of a concussion, that's moshing. It's all too commonplace. That's the kind I was referring to. Jumping up and down, that's fine with me. I guess I have a mistaken view of moshing.
1. I am a fsh with no i's.
2. You must be wearing Zubaz, 'cause you're daring to be different.
3. I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
| Homers_pet_monkey |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 14:28:59
That's extreme moshing, and just plain annoying. I consider jumping up and down in a crowd at a gig to be moshing. Am I wrong?
Pixies!?!? Pixies!?!? Don't talk to me about the Pixies!!!.........OK, talk to me about the Pixies!!! |
| The Calistanian |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 14:26:01
No.
Of course music can make you move...that's why people dance, tap their toes, or bob their heads. But slamming into people in a crazed fashion for no rhyme, reason, or rhythm has nothing to do with music.
1. I am a fsh with no i's.
2. You must be wearing Zubaz, 'cause you're daring to be different.
3. I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
| Homers_pet_monkey |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 14:12:28
Are you saying that music can't make you move? Moshing is just a way of moving. Some music, you just can't dance to, it just makes you jump about. It's a primal urge.
Pixies!?!? Pixies!?!? Don't talk to me about the Pixies!!!.........OK, talk to me about the Pixies!!! |
| The Calistanian |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 14:03:11
There's no way that music can make a person mosh. It's just poser action. It shows noninterest in the music itself. If you want to mosh, go to Gwar, where it doesn't really matter what happens.
However, any Barry White CD is good for the "horizontal mosh"...
1. I am a fsh with no i's.
2. You must be wearing Zubaz, 'cause you're daring to be different.
3. I am a man with 3 fingers...but that doesn't count my index finger nor my thumb. |
| therewererumours |
Posted - 06/07/2004 : 19:02:29
I'm getting up front, but God help anyone who ruins my listening pleasure!  The peps in th Pixies DVD did'nt seem to do any crowd surfing. I hope people while try to appreciate the music, but it's a big day out for most people, who will fuck around.
He's coming to save your mind and town |
| mun chien andalusia |
Posted - 06/07/2004 : 18:46:44
depends on the group. you just couldn't sit behind and listen to the music at a Ramones gig.
 join the cult of errol\and you can have a beer\without having to quit smoking
|
| therewererumours |
Posted - 06/07/2004 : 18:40:33
For peps with glasses, moshing is a pain in the hole, but I like to bob up and down abit. I think I'm going to be fucked on the 12th (Pixies in the Pheonix Park). When the kids (I mean hyper 15 year olds who have too much to drink), saw Frank at Witness, there was way too much annoying moshing( I got kicked in the head twice), but at his Vicar St. gig it was non-existent becauce it was the fans. With the Pixies the kids are going to start jumping all over the place, especially after an afternoon of drinking. I hate that the Pixies are doing a guest spot they really should have their own gig.
He's coming to save your mind and town |
| SpudBoy |
Posted - 06/07/2004 : 17:14:33
I've been thinking about a Personal Electric Fence for just such an occasion. Might make it hard to hear the music over the screams of "Ow! Fuck!" though...
 |
| Ziggy |
Posted - 06/07/2004 : 06:20:59
I went on Friday, stupidly stood at the front, and it was fucking rough. Should've known better. I would've been fine alone, but my sister was beat up a little and terrifed of the moshers around her. Trying to move out of the crowd, even when the song was finished, was impossible. By all means, have, fun, but don't be so damn selfish!
The evening was ruined by people who were apparently there to get wrecked, shove each other round, and yell tunelessly to 'Where Is My Mind'.
Hey, I'm only 18, but I was kinda hoping to appreciate the music too.
"Me and the chickens running in the street" |
| blackpurse |
Posted - 06/07/2004 : 05:27:27
quote:
Originally posted by SpudBoy
I struggle with this. This is something that came from punk. In that vein it was a very appropriate and good thing, with a culture that supported it - watching out for others, not kidney-punching those nearby, etc. - and was a freaking blast to be in. Everyone stayed at arm length apart, or sometimes leg-length; One of my friends is trying to acquire video of a show in the late 80s in which he loses a converse all-star sneaker to another kid's mouth. I was there that night, and remember the stunned look on the kid's face what with a shoe appearing in his gob. Even with that, it ended well. Anyway, I blame the Seattle/Grunge exploitation for the Death of Mosh. That got the masses into it, and without the context, it became outright violent and silly. Crowd surfing and shoving took over from the lawnmower and skanking proper. I have seen moshing in country music videos while channel surfing. That's fucking stupid. Not to be overly elitist on the adoption of an expressive form, but really - without the culture it just isn't the same. Thus, for the Pixies, Not Mosh for me. Last time I was in a good circle pit near Frank Black was when he opened for the Ramones. Everyone stood and watched Frank, then took the floor apart for Joey R & co. Besides - with this new-fangled (ok the last 10 years or so) style of moshing everyone rubs their ugly ass sweaty selves on you. I'm there for the music, not the hepatitis.
Nice post. I too remember the late 70s, early 80s, when we didn't even call it moshing, it was "slam dancing." And it was a blast. I was one of the few girls in the pit, I was sure to wear a bodysuit, an athletic bra, and my "gnarly thrash boots". And it was actually somewhat "polite": at the '83 X show in Chicago, somebody fell down. The pit cleared around the person, somebody helped them up, and once the "victim" gave the "I'm OK" thumbs up, we all went back to slamming again. Loved it. I'm really sad that you can't go to a good punk show these days without either being banned from doing it, or stuck with a bunch of assholes who don't get it. And the Pixies never struck me as a moshing band. Slam dancing during songs like "Tame" yes. But you're right, there's people htere who mosh for the sake of moshing.
"Sacred cows make the best burgers!" |
| Malax |
Posted - 06/06/2004 : 16:32:07
I think I saw some really huge guy being dragged out of the 'pit' by about 25 bouncers the other night, shortly afterwards I was hit on the back of the head by a crowd surfer which jerked my head forward into the guys infront now I have a nsaty bump just above my eye. Fucker. I've been to gigs were people punch and rip clothes of crowd surfers. I'd never do it at a busy gig, but I have been known to do it at smaller more punky gigs, were people are much friendlier.
I May've Joined The Cult Of Frank If I Knew What The Balls Was Going On.
*Adapted By Carolynanna* |
| Homers_pet_monkey |
Posted - 06/06/2004 : 15:46:11
Yeah exactly, if everyone around you is doing it then I don't see the problem. If you are going to see a lively band, then you have to expect some moshing, so place youself accordingly. It's pretty simple really. Crowd surfing is pretty annoying. I had a couple of people fall on my head last night at the Ash gig I attended. That was the closest I have ever come to leaving a moshpit, it was sooo damn hot!!! I nearly passed out.
Pixies!?!? Pixies!?!? Don't talk to me about the Pixies!!!.........OK, talk to me about the Pixies!!! |
| Malax |
Posted - 06/06/2004 : 12:40:55
Friday I sort of half moshed. I enjoyed the show and everytime I was pushed forward I went with the flow. I enjoy moshing but I only do it in the crowd of people who are also doing it (generally at the front) rather than starting my own craziness behind a bunch of guys/girls standing watching.
I May've Joined The Cult Of Frank If I Knew What The Balls Was Going On.
*Adapted By Carolynanna* |
| guy_nolan |
Posted - 06/06/2004 : 11:06:55
I couldn't help myself on Friday, sore neck the next day but it really enhanced the night for me so I agree with vovat. Mosh with consideration.
For ten thousand years he slept, his mind feeding on the nightmares of the weak. Now he has awakened. As the night turned crimson, the fire-blade shattered and his power died. Then, the slaughter began... |
| Jason |
Posted - 06/06/2004 : 11:03:45
Do people still crowd surf? In my college days, I saw about one show a week and now I go to about 4 shows a year.
One memorable crowd surfer admonishment I've seen was at a Blur gig in early 1996 (a small 200-person club show in Texas, while they were playing stadiums in Europe!). Some yahoo was crowd surfing while the band did "To the End" (slow song). In the middle of the song, Damon Albarn said something like "What's the matter with you? Why don't you just listen to the music?" and half the room clapped. |
| gracie |
Posted - 06/06/2004 : 05:46:31
In the early 90's i seem to remeber reading that may riot grrl bands had female only mosh pits. I would have liked to have seen that, i bet it was a whole different experience.
I'm about 5'8 so i'm ok in most pits but i see other women who are fairly small and they have a really hard time and usually have to be pulled out.
I saw the Yeah Yeah Yeah's a few months ago (With the Locusts in support, but they just got bottled, no mosh pit for them) and a crowd surfer kicked this girl in the head and knocked her out. She just collapsed and had to be pulled out. No one goes to see a band for that.
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| gracie |
Posted - 06/06/2004 : 05:37:47
I like having a jump around but actually pushing other people for no good reason and throwing your arms about (usually holding a fag) and headbaging just really annoys me.
It sad to say but men are the worst culprits for this and some don't seem to have a good time unless they are making others uncomfortable.
Crowd surfers are the worst, its just so antisocial and i've lost count of the amount of times tht 've got kicked or kneed in the head.
On Wednesday night i was at the front and spent most of the time trying to keep upright and fending off arseholes. Needless to say on Friday and Saturday i stood further back.
The moral of the story? If you want to watch the band and not get your legs broken don't stand at the front. |
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