| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| ShakeyShake |
Posted - 03/03/2004 : 15:04:26
Yeah i know(or think at least)that this was posted before but i cudnt be arsed 2 wade through the archives and find it.
What's everyone's opinion on a public smoking ban?I can sorta understand if its places like shopping centres,but a ban in pubs?I mean i enjoy smoking while im having a drink,someone else may not,but thats to be expected in a pub, and really,what is between us?why should non-smokers have more rights than smokers?
"I joined the Cult of Frank / 28:06:42:12" |
| 35 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Dave Noisy |
Posted - 03/25/2004 : 09:57:01
heh - i don't know if you're trying to be funny Mel, but in Canada (and presumably the UK) it's costing the gov't an arm and a leg to treat people with related cancers...i really don't think they're making very much on the sales.
 Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer! |
| thermoplastics |
Posted - 03/24/2004 : 18:06:44
what a bunch of puritanical do-gooders. The main argument used to ban smoking involve a safe working enviroment. OSHA, which sets all legal standards for toxins in a work place, cant seem to find one for second hand smoke. For every other workplace toxin they have a number---why not for smoking? The reason is junk science. These are the smae people who predicted a nuclear winter (now global warming) and overpopulation by 1990!!! |
| benji |
Posted - 03/24/2004 : 03:32:40
was just reading a thing on the BBC newsite about a poll they did where 73% of respondants want a ban on smoking in all public places as a way to cut tobacco-related illness...
in England, that is....
am suprised that it's so high.
and i must say, pleased too.
but i don't think the survey is the most comprehensive and statistically robust survey ever done, but nonetheless.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3561483.stm
 "I joined the Cult of Frank / I think that man deserves a DB!" |
| gk128 |
Posted - 03/15/2004 : 05:45:23
As my Mom's boyfriend put it "I don't want to be breathing in that shit while I'm trying to ruin my liver."
This was of course sarcastic, and refering to a bar. However it makes a good point.
My CD List:
www.cd-tracker.com/~gk128 |
| Dave Noisy |
Posted - 03/10/2004 : 10:33:50
How would a nightclub lose $$ if the ban is only before 7pm?
Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer! |
| benji |
Posted - 03/10/2004 : 06:22:18
I noticed an article today saying the Leeds University have lifted a smoking ban in the 5 pubs and 3 nite-clubs on campus because they lost £26,000 in the first 13 days of the ban being enforced.
thats pretty crazy - as in the amount of money they lost, but the ban was only in place before 7pm!
http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91059-13009894,00.html
i can understand that though, cause we would always go to the student pub at lunch times for a pint or 2, and it was always smoky as hell...
"I joined the Cult of Frank / I think that man deserves a DB!" |
| offerw |
Posted - 03/05/2004 : 21:40:15
[quote]Originally posted by Cheeseman1000
Problem is, everybody's teeth are already yellow!
How is SA, btw? I'm planning a trip there next month.
Sorry about about going way off topic here. I'll just quickly reply to the question above.
SA is a brilliant place. I guess you have already booked your trip if it is happening next month? Cape Town is the most beautifull with great beaches, mountains and wine farms. Great restaurants as well, just watch out for the expensive touristy ones at the V&A Waterfront.
The next popular place is Kruger National Park. It is a massive place with huge elephants, lions, buffalo etc. walking around freely. Just remember malaria prophylaxis, we've had lots of rain and there might be lots of mosquitoes. Consult a travel clinic. Oh yeah, if your'e driving there avoid doing so at night.
Johannesburg/ Pretoria (where I live) is not a favorite tourist destination. Up here we work, work, work. The engine room of the country. There are a few museums about, good cinemas if you're into films and great restaurants.
I'm sure you've been warned that we have a huge problem with crime. So just remember to keep your eyes open. And if you're driving be warned that we have some of the worst drivers in the world.
If you want to know more send me an e-mail. |
| Dave Noisy |
Posted - 03/05/2004 : 10:58:16
Interesting point about making smoking legal in all places..
Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer! |
| Newo |
Posted - 03/05/2004 : 08:45:46
I don´t smoke anymore and find it quite revolting (like many exsmokers who´ve rubberbanded to the other extreme) but as regards the smoking ban in my home country (Ireland) which I hear is coming in about now, I don´t feel I or anyone else has the authority to tell others what they can or can´t do. Trouble is when you start throwing walls up and making rules in a patriarchal society, you end up drawing the line in a pretty totalitarian place. Anyone else feel this way?
--
"You one of those right-wing nut outfits?" inquired the diplomatic Metzger.
Fallopian twinkled. "They accuse us of being paranoids."
"They?" inquired Metzger, twinkling also.
"Us?" asked Oedipa.
|
| The Calistanian |
Posted - 03/05/2004 : 08:11:11
Frankly, smoking has progressed so far in history now, that you can't do anything about it without making smokers spaz out. It's too late to do anything about it now, government. Government, if you put a national ban on smoking now, how will they be cool anymore? You will take away the smokers' feeling of security, causing age-old emotions of an adolescent's needing to fit in to stir up.
Ahh...I'm just kidding ya smokers.
I'm a fsh with no i's. |
| Erebus |
Posted - 03/05/2004 : 08:04:50
quote:
Originally posted by speedy_m
quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
quote:
Originally posted by PixieSteve
i wouldn't be bothered by a ban public smoking. basically because i don't smoke and it can only benefit me... haha.
This is such an unprincipled statement that I can only assume you're joking. You are joking, right?
Unprincpled like this, Erebus?
"Given human nature, anything that keeps us from realizing our true potential has my vote." - Erebus
Hey, that's principled! ;) a la human nature as brutish should therefore be limited. or, as the Nietzsche said, "Human All Too Human". |
| jimmy |
Posted - 03/05/2004 : 07:37:56
Public opinion about smoking is always changing and if it changes back in favor of smoking here's what could happen:
Laws might be passed requiring all resturants and bars to allow smoking. Why not- if you guys have already established that the owners don't have a right to decide about their own property, then this could happen too. |
| speedy_m |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 21:35:09
quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
quote:
Originally posted by PixieSteve
i wouldn't be bothered by a ban public smoking. basically because i don't smoke and it can only benefit me... haha.
This is such an unprincipled statement that I can only assume you're joking. You are joking, right?
Unprincpled like this, Erebus?
"Given human nature, anything that keeps us from realizing our true potential has my vote." - Erebus |
| realmeanmotorscutor |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 21:19:20
yes, because supportinga smoking ban for the health of the masses is clearly insane.
 "I joined the Cult of Popeye / The CoF required my good eye" |
| Erebus |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 19:49:56
Congrats, VoVat, you get the sanity award, for a nonsmoker that is. |
| VoVat |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 16:47:53
quote:
I don't think a public smoking ban should be enforced nationally or state wide. I think it should be up to the individual business or chain to decide whether or not they want to allow smoking.
I'd have to agree with this, really. I think smoking is disgusting and I'd rather not have to breathe it in, but I don't think it's the place of the government to dictate whether or not businesses should allow it. I can generally make my own decision to avoid smoke-filled buildings.
Join the Culf of Buttoms / It's the Alerican way. |
| holidaysong |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 12:55:02
Irelands smoking ban gna be very very hard to enforce me thinks - do u wana try stop big drunk irish guys from stopping smoking at 11pm when they know too well u aint gna ring the gardaí on them..but hey i'm all for it.
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| mun chien andalusia |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 11:45:54
i say fuck at those stupid anti smoke overeaction.w.t.f?ban cars and petrol too if you think that this will save you from something.passive smoke damage is so pumped up that it makes me sick.it's illegal to smoke a sigarette in a stadium but it's legal to drive a SUV that burns 15-18 lt per 100km.human hypocricy at it's best.
some medical facts:
1)active smoking increases the PROBABILITY of lung cancer and does not directly causes it.in fact i know a couple of 90 year olds that smoke 2 packs a day.
2)passive smoking IS harmful for your health but it's not worse than normal city smog pollution
i'm not trying to say that smoking is good for you but stop it with this hysterical overeactions.the issue has nothing to do with health or ethics.it's plain hysteria "oh my god,he's smoking!my baby will be born with 3 legs and a lung cancer"
 join the cult of errol\and you can have a beer\without having to quit smoking
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| PixieSteve |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 11:43:35
well, it wasn't meant to be taken too seriously. but really, i don't smoke, i think it's a filthy habit, but I am not that bothered by public smokers. Whether or not it gets banned is not really an area I am interested in. |
| Erebus |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 11:27:54
quote:
Originally posted by PixieSteve
i wouldn't be bothered by a ban public smoking. basically because i don't smoke and it can only benefit me... haha.
This is such an unprincipled statement that I can only assume you're joking. You are joking, right? |
| PixieSteve |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 11:24:20
i wouldn't be bothered by a ban public smoking. basically because i don't smoke and it can only benefit me... haha. |
| Cheeseman1000 |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 10:43:53
Problem is, everybody's teeth are already yellow!
How is SA, btw? I'm planning a trip there next month.
 "Join the cult of scone/And succumb to the power of the cream tea" |
| offerw |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 10:39:26
In South Africa smoking in a public place has been banned for the past few years now. Restaurants must have sectioned off designated smoking areas, if anyone is caught smoking outside of these areas the restaurant owner has to pay a huge fine. It works! You can eat without some selfish prick spoiling your meal with his eye stinging, lung scorching fumes.
When I visited Europe last year I was reminded once again how unpleasant it was to have smoke being blown into your face wherever you walk or sit down to eat or drink. I was amazed at how many young people were smoking like it is the coolest thing ever.
Quit smoking, it makes your teeth go yellow kids! |
| Cheeseman1000 |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 10:33:24
Generally I don't argue either way with this subject, but it would be kind of nice to not have to come home reeking from a show.
Red Ken was trying to introduce a ban on public smoking a while ago, but I haven't heard much recently. I think it goes against a lot of British nature for this kind of infringement, but then look at our archaic licensing laws...
Still undecided though.
"Join the cult of scone/And succumb to the power of the cream tea" |
| BLT |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 10:08:07
I think you're a little off base with this one. A business that caters to the general public is still governed by laws in the interest of public safety/health. If you want to be exempt from some of that, you could turn it into a private club and require membership, but it still wouldn't exempt you from all laws. There are more rights than just "an individual's property rights". Should a restaurateur (who caters openly to the public) be allowed to refuse entry to health inspectors because it's "his property"? What about the fire department? |
| jimmy |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 09:49:44
The employees- I don't believe that changes anything. Those employees have a choice of whether or not to work at a place where smoking is allowed.
This is another example of people claiming to hold non-existant rights. In this case, all that matters is an individual's property rights- the resturant and bar owners. Just as the public doesn't have a right to demand how someone else runs their own business, employees do not have a right to make those demands either.
It seems that these days, very few people are in favor of allowing people to deal with one another voluntarily- meaning if you don't like the policies of a certain business, then you don't have anything to do with them.
People don't care about the fairness of laws, only whether or not they favor their own position. |
| The Holiday Son |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 05:37:03
I'm all for it.
cf realmeanmotorscutor and dave's posts. |
| ispini tapaidh |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 05:20:07
The ban is set to start on the 29th of March here in Ireland. It's not being banned in public places per se, but all places of employment (with a few exceptions such as mental institutions, hotel rooms and a couple of others). The pubs and hotels have been kicking up shite about it for ages, and there may be another legal challenge to it in the pipeline, but I have to say I agree with the ban from the point of view of the employee's health. It just makes sense. |
| benji |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 02:53:33
i fully support a ban on smoking in public places.
and i think the points raised here sum it all up, so i won't repeat any of them.
I believe Ireland has very recently brought in or is bringing in a ban of such magnitude, so i'd be interested in hearing an Irishman's view (Carl?).
I also think New Zealand is about to bring one in, and i cannot wait to go home once it does.
"I joined the Cult of Frank / I think that man deserves a DB!" |
| Scarla O |
Posted - 03/04/2004 : 01:33:32
"Obnoxious , self-righteous, whining little fucks. My biggest fear is that if I quit smoking, I'll become one of you...Don't take that wrong. I have something to tell you non-smokers that I know for a fact that you don't know, and I feel it's my duty to pass on information at all times. Ready?.......Non-smokers die every day...Enjoy your evening. See, I know that you entertain this eternal life fantasy because you've chosen not to smoke, but let me be the 1st to POP that bubble and bring you hurtling back to reality....You're dead too. "
Bill Hicks
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| ProverbialCereal |
Posted - 03/03/2004 : 22:36:00
I wouldn't mind a public smoking ban. I should have the right to breath in smoke-free air all the time. I can't hold my breath everytime I'm around a smoker. And another thing, it sounds so stupid saying "I have the right to breath fresh air." It shouldn't be a right, it should be an automatically natural thing that I don't have to breath in smoke from a man-made cancer joint
C'mon guys, Tom Waits quit smoking. You can too.
 Join the Devil's Workshop / Looking for idle hands to work second shift |
| Dave Noisy |
Posted - 03/03/2004 : 22:11:04
Funny this came up, they're discussing a province-wide ban of smoking in public places in Mantoba.
I'm all for it.
I absolutely hate having to breath smoke when i'm at a show, and i come home smelling like it. Not to mention i'm mildly allergic to it.
On top of that, smoke is harmful. I can't go and release other toxic gases in public places, why can smokers do it? And why do employee's have to put up with it as well? (Thanks BLT.)
If there are other known carcinogens on a worksite, they HAVE to be removed, thanks to Federal regulations. It's absolutely ridiculous that this known carcinogen is allowed to be spread in public places.
Individual enforcement is generally ruled by finances, and i don't think that is an appropriate way to determine the handling of carcinogens.
It's bad enough companies are fined less to dump toxins into rivers than pay for proper disposal...
It's a public health concern, and it infringes on one's right not to be harmed by others. I really don't understand why there is any controversy at all.
Join the Cult of the Flying Pigxies - I'm A Believer! |
| BLT |
Posted - 03/03/2004 : 21:56:07
If the owner decides to allow smoking, then the employees get screwed. If a waitress doesn't want to breathe smoke 8 hours/day, is her only option to quit? Somehow that doesn't seem fair. |
| jimmy |
Posted - 03/03/2004 : 20:45:58
Whenever I read in the papers about smoking bans I see always see the same arguments: The rights of smokers vs. the rights of non-smokers. And I hardly ever see the argument that El Barto makes.
He is exactly right: So-called public places like resturants and bars are not owned by the public. Whoever owns the business should decide whether or not to allow smoking. Then customers can decide for themselves whether or not to go there.
Unfortunately its usually resturant and bar owners themselves who are throwing away their own rights. For instance, one resturant owner may ban smoking at his place, but once he sees the drop in business, he tries to get the city to ban smoking in all resturants so there will be a "level playing field". Then when people start going to neighboring towns, more owners from the original city make the same arguement to get a statewide ban. |
| NimrodsSon |
Posted - 03/03/2004 : 19:15:29
I'm all for a public smoking ban for pretty much exactly the same reason as what realmeanmotorscutor said. I think we're getting one over here in Gwinnett County, GA, where I live very soon
¡Viva los Católicos! |
