| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
|
|
apl4eris
~ Abstract Brain ~
USA
4800 Posts |
 Posted - 07/02/2004 : 10:33:44
|
Man, if only voting for the other party meant a hill o' beans difference. American "democracy", it's like pissin' in the wind. hey wait..!
 |
 |
|
|
shineoftheever
> Teenager of the Year <
Canada
4307 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 10:39:55
|
or as ween might have it "pissing up a rope".
"That's Nuckin' Futs" |
|
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 10:44:45
|
| Does the hill o' beans refer to a lack of a thoroughly appealing candidate, or to the ineffectualness of a single vote? |
|
|
|
Jose Jones
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1758 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 10:46:03
|
| a little from column A, a little from column B... |
|
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 10:48:32
|
| So are people here.. uhh.. not voting? |
|
|
|
Mroocore
- FB Fan -
USA
177 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 11:25:51
|
quote:
Originally posted by Minky303
So are people here.. uhh.. not voting?
why would you?
it only encourages them.
i jest, but...
 PENGU LIES |
|
|
|
Steak n Sabre
* Dog in the Sand *
Uzbekistan
1013 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 11:44:09
|
Nice advert for trickle-down economics...
 The Cult of Frank: Vorsprung Durch Technik |
|
|
|
floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 12:30:01
|
www.johnkerryisadouchebagbutimvotingforhimanyway.com |
|
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 13:05:42
|
I hope I'm preaching to the choir here.. but please, Americans, (now I feel like a politician :) .. VOTE!!!! Even if you don't like any of the candidates, I would personally hope you want Bush out of office.. Its our responsibility to make sure that happens.. The more apathetic, cynical voters that get out there, the better. It will only take a minute, just make sure you choose Kerry. I haven't stuck a needle in him, he could very well BE a douche bag, but any douche bag beats another gruesome four years of Bush.
You can get a voter registration form at: http://www.fec.gov/votregis/pdf/nvra.pdf
And if you're not in the city you're registered to vote in, apply for an absentee ballot. I believe most states require that you request this 30-60days prior to the election date so do it now and you can vote via mail.
Also.. you can sign a petition & send a letter to Ralph Nader politely asking him to drop out of the 2004 elections at: www.democracymeansyou.com/nader/
His 2-3% of votes in 2000 contributed to the "problem" in Florida, and this election is going to be too close to let it happen AGAIN..
|
|
|
|
floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 13:11:23
|
quote:
Originally posted by Minky303
he could very well BE a douche bag, but any douche bag beats another gruesome four years of Bush.
that's essentially the view of the website. which, sadly, i think i agree with (sadly becuase i wish there were better candidates) |
|
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 13:13:13
|
Below is a copy of the petition to Nader.. Sign it, get all your peeps to sign it, yep.
(www.democracymeansyou.com/nader)
Ralph, we have a lot of respect for you.
But you're making a big mistake.
PLEASE. GET OUT OF THE 2004 ELECTION!
The country cannot afford to lose 1-4% points to you in the election this time. It's too crucial.
We are voters who believe that third parties are crucial to true Democracy and need to be viable without being "spoilers."
We believe that as environmentalists, as liberals, as lefties, it's more important to vote strategically this year than to vote for you, as much as we agree with your positions.
Having real world principles means that sometimes you need to do what's pragmatically best, even if it isn't ideal. That's real commitment. Sticking with stated rigid so-called "principles" to the bitter end, regardless of the consequences, regardless of reason, regardless of hypocrisy, is what people like John Ashcroft and Paul Wolfowitz do. You're better than that.
The risks to our Democracy of another four years of Bush are too great. We believe it best serves all liberal causes to have our first priority be removing Bush and the GOP majority in both houses.
You have an opportunity to serve the cause of third parties and free Democracy here, not by continuing your campaign, but by extracting a promise from the DNC to put in place and support INSTANT RUNOFF VOTING &/or FUSION VOTING in four Democratically-controlled states by the 2006 election in exchange for your dropping out of the race this year.
We urge you to use this opportunity to leverage and extract committments from the DNC that will get INSTANT RUNOFF VOTING &/or FUSION VOTING in place by the 2006 election.
That's real commitment.
I will be voting for Kerry in 2004 regardless of your actions, but I urge you to use take this opportunity to make a greater good by getting a commitment by the Democrats to support putting IRV/Fusion in place rather than making a "point" by running in 2004 and possibly contributing to another four years of a GOP White House.
Sincerely,
|
|
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 13:21:06
|
| Floop - Yeah I liked that website (or, the essays the guy had finished :) .. Even though he DEFINITELY has my vote, I'm not sure what I think of Kerry either.. I find it hard to believe a word any politician says anyway. So many words so little truth *sighs* - but without a shadow of a doubt he should be the next prez |
Edited by - Minky303 on 07/02/2004 13:23:25 |
|
|
|
floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 13:31:21
|
four years ago, i got into arguments with people who said that voting for Nader was "wasting your vote" (i voted for Nader). this year, i'm taking a different approach. i'd love to give my support to a party that, i feel, is fighting-the-good-fight but i feel like getting Bush out of office is more important at this point in time.
regardless of who you vote for, i agree.. VOTE!!! everyone needs to vote damn it.
(that's about as political as i'll get) |
|
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 13:48:01
|
| Yeah I wish I could transplant Nader's brain into Kerry's body and political party for this election so he could have a chance. |
|
|
|
Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:08:18
|
quote:
Originally posted by floop
regardless of who you vote for, i agree.. VOTE!!! everyone needs to vote damn it.
(that's about as political as i'll get)
In 2000 there were precincts carried by Gore where exit polls showed over half of the Gore voters could not name his running mate (and don't even try to tell me anything like that could be said of Bush precincts). Even if I had not already long been a refusnik re voting, that would have clinched it for me. If you want to sanction the idea that your vote is genuinely equivalent with that of these morons, please do vote. However, if you retain a modicum of self-respect, don't. |
|
|
|
Mroocore
- FB Fan -
USA
177 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:14:12
|
john f. kerry is a liberal, flip floping, absentee, social-class marrying, lying, hypocritical, card-carrying democrat.
you can check on each and every one of those claims.
imo he may actually be worse than the clintons.
i am very thankful(this november) that i can vote my conscience and not worry about the effects(i.e. the nader effect) it will have on this presidential election.
thanks to the many Commonwealth of Massachusetts liberals.
there are however many states where voters are in a much more difficult position.
places where your vote may actually count(can you believe it) towards this novembers presidential election.
this may or may not be a tough choice for you, but it would be for me.
places like Minnesota, Iowa, Pennsylvania, Oregon, Washington State, Ohio, Michigan, Georgia, Tennessee, North Carolina, Oklahoma, Indiana, Virginia District of Columbia and Florida (whose electoral votes decided the 2000 election in favour of bush) are all up for grabs, most other states are already decide.
these are the states that matter.
their citizens hold the true power of a democratic nation.
like i said before, i do not envy your task.
PENGU LIES |
|
|
|
floop
= Wannabe Volunteer =
Mexico
15297 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:15:48
|
| so your vote doesn't count? i thought they counted the votes (literally). i guess i'm mistaken |
|
|
|
Mroocore
- FB Fan -
USA
177 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:18:04
|
quote:
Originally posted by floop
so your vote doesn't count? i thought they counted the votes (literally). i guess i'm mistaken
are you playing or are you for real?
PENGU LIES |
|
|
|
apl4eris
~ Abstract Brain ~
USA
4800 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:55:22
|
I think Bush and Kerry are both awful, and no matter who wins, government will always do what it can to preserve what power it has, no matter what party it says it is adhering to. All the shit that's come down the pike over the last many years will remain (yes Clinton too), and they will throw a bone to appease when the masses finally get pissed.
I would have considered the concept of appearing to be voting for Nader, not only on the the principle of having more than one party and shaking up the stagnant and entrenched power structure of the 2 "parties", but I was also hoping for what he said he was hoping for -for his appearance in the race to force Kerry to differentiate himself from Bush.
I'm damn tired of this "lesser of two evils" game, and the anachronistic irrelevance of the Electoral college. But now that Nader has declared his running mate (ran for Socialist Workers' Party president in 1976 - what the hell were you thinking Nader?!), I am running as fast as I can in the other direction. I have no idea what I am going to do. I have voted up until now, but I am pretty frustrated. This voting solution is all looking and smelling more and more like a red herring. The parties have fallen over each other to mostly work for the same things (more money and power and secrecy for governement, more money and influencial power for corporations, more money and power for the military-industrial complex), and then just win an election on negative campaigning and a sprinkling of emotional/moral issues (the bone that gets tossed to stir up the masses and make 'em happy).
|
Edited by - apl4eris on 07/02/2004 15:02:17 |
|
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:56:35
|
I mean, they do tally all the popular votes. Right? So even if you vote just to save a little U.S. face .. to bump up those popular-votes so there is a greater disparity between them and the electorals (should the (worst) bad man win)...
Otherwise put people should vote to show there is a problem with the system - to generate substantial proof perhaps?
I live in NC, moving to WA. Both "hot states" on mroocore's list, so yeah I take this seriously. Pained Confession: I didn't vote in 2000 partially out of apathy, partially because I was 5hrs from the county I was registered to vote in [waited too late for the absentee mail-in]. Anyway I've been kicking myself for 4 years. I fail to see how inaction/not voting despite your reasons for doing so helps a damn thing |
|
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:59:40
|
| Umm my primary goal here being remove the nasty blood-filled half-leech/half-tick from the US's face |
Edited by - Minky303 on 07/02/2004 15:03:03 |
|
|
|
Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 15:03:16
|
quote:
Originally posted by Minky303
I fail to see how inaction/not voting despite your reasons for doing so helps a damn thing
It might bring about national collapse and civil war, and that would help a lot. In any case, that is where we are headed. The sooner the better. No nation ever deserved it more. |
|
|
|
GypsyDeath
Zapped Profile
3575 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 15:05:21
|
Wannadies, anyone?
Just thought I'd throw that in there... |
|
|
|
Mroocore
- FB Fan -
USA
177 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 15:08:29
|
apl i agree, but have faith.
minky, yes, they do count all the popular votes.
even if your canidate does not win there is political gain.
party votes and or support will force the big two to take notice.
also if a third party recieves a certain % of the votes in consecutive elections then it will be added to the ticket for trhe next year.
ie green party in 22 states this election.
i will not vote for either a democrat or a republican until one of the parties begains to represent the people of america.
not voting will not solve our problems.
PENGU LIES |
|
|
|
Minky303
- FB Fan -
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 15:15:20
|
quote:
Originally posted by Erebus
quote:
Originally posted by Minky303
I fail to see how inaction/not voting despite your reasons for doing so helps a damn thing
It might bring about national collapse and civil war, and that would help a lot. In any case, that is where we are headed. The sooner the better. No nation ever deserved it more.
I can see your point, and I agree on some frightening level (its hard to ignore). But no one would notice that people weren't voting.. its been going on for quite a while, am I wrong? .. My train of thought is to do whatever I can in the present, baby steps. Baby step #1 - get Dubya out. Because that lessens (I think) the chance of the world collapsing; instead of just U.S. |
|
|
|
Mroocore
- FB Fan -
USA
177 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 15:33:05
|
quote:
Originally posted by GypsyDeath
Wannadies, anyone?
Just thought I'd throw that in there...
Gypsy, if by Wannadies you are refering to the meaning of the seperation of the two words wanna and die.
i totally agree and would add if you want all the people you love to die, then a national collapse and civil war would be one way to achieve that goal.
if not, what does that mean?
PENGU LIES |
|
|
|
Erebus
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1834 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 16:10:51
|
quote:
Originally posted by Mroocore
if you want all the people you love to die, then a national collapse and civil war would be one way to achieve that goal.
if not, what does that mean?
It could also be that one would like to see a rebirth of quality, replacing the rot we call civilization. Parasites begone! |
|
|
|
GypsyDeath
Zapped Profile
3575 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 16:15:41
|
quote:
Originally posted by Mroocore
quote:
Originally posted by GypsyDeath
Wannadies, anyone?
Just thought I'd throw that in there...
Gypsy, if by Wannadies you are refering to the meaning of the seperation of the two words wanna and die.
i totally agree and would add if you want all the people you love to die, then a national collapse and civil war would be one way to achieve that goal.
if not, what does that mean?
haha, intersting interpretaion, but no, i waas actually referring to The Wannadies song 'Piss on You'...which actually has nothing to do with this thread..only the title. so yeah.
Just thought I'd throw that in there... |
|
|
|
VoVat
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
USA
9168 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2004 : 17:03:42
|
quote:
It might bring about national collapse and civil war, and that would help a lot.
Wouldn't help me much, I'm afraid. Then again, if Erebus had his way, I'd probably be dead by now.
Cattle in Korea / They can really moo. |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
Go ahead! Piss on me! I'm pissing on you!
