| Author |
 Topic  |
|
apl4eris
~ Abstract Brain ~
USA
4800 Posts |
 Posted - 10/14/2003 : 22:57:02
|
No hadn't heard of it (your sig). Learned about it in school of course, but also have a few friends who were nuclear engineering students (only one of them actually does it for a living now - kinda funny). One of them (he works for the Chicago Water Reclamation Dept. heheh) had a trunk in his apartment with "Schroedinger's Cat" written on the side. Always a good conversation starter at parties ;)! He had some other really cool instruments in there as well - some old generators that would throw great arcs and reset his stereo equipment...but I digress....:)
Where are we going?
Planet ten!
When?
Real soon!! |
 |
|
|
apl4eris
~ Abstract Brain ~
USA
4800 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2003 : 22:59:06
|
BTW COF - I bet Foucault's Dog (saw him? on this board pretty recently) will have an inkling ;) -Just a hunch...
Where are we going?
Planet ten!
When?
Real soon!! |
|
|
|
Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2003 : 23:22:24
|
quote:
Originally posted by glacial906
My old signature was about quantum nonlocality; had you heard of that?
Only vaguely, I'd never really studied it in much detail. We discussed it, remember? Don't you? <sniff>
 "Join the Cult of Frank / And you'll be enlightened" |
|
|
|
Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2003 : 23:23:37
|
quote:
Originally posted by apl4eris
BTW COF - I bet Foucault's Dog (saw him? on this board pretty recently) will have an inkling ;) -Just a hunch...
Where are we going?
Planet ten!
When?
Real soon!!
Yeah, either that or the name's a ridiculous coincidence, but I don't think he? was around at the time. :)
"Join the Cult of Frank / And you'll be enlightened" |
|
|
|
Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2003 : 14:49:20
|
| What's the story on the S-cat? |
|
|
|
Brackish Girl
~ Soul Eater ~
Ireland
1750 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2003 : 15:22:43
|
heh. s-cat.
"I joined the Cult of Trippy/ but i got no icon cos stupid Dean won't tell me how to make one" |
|
|
|
speedy_m
= Frankofile =
Canada
3581 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2003 : 18:31:40
|
I you're refering to what I think you're refering to Jessie, you are one dirty, filthy, disgusting girl. I like it.
 ixies |
Edited by - speedy_m on 10/15/2003 18:35:47 |
|
|
|
cvanepps
= Cult of Ray =
USA
442 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2003 : 19:32:01
|
quote:
Originally posted by the swimmer
3. I am not a malaka.
She's into malakas, Dino.
-= It's not easy to kidnap a fat man =-
http://christophervanepps.iuma.com |
|
|
|
Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2003 : 23:26:59
|
Well, I was waiting 'cause I figured that apl would explain Schroedinger and his cat and I didn't want to get in to it at work, but now I'm home and it's late so I'm still not going to. But I'm very happy I went to work tonight. If she doesn't help you tomorrow, I'll try.
"Join the Cult of Frank / And you'll be enlightened" |
|
|
|
glacial906
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1738 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2003 : 23:56:19
|
Dave, I know a bit about the Schroedinger's cat experiment. Maybe COF can elaborate on it more, he seems more technically-oriented than I. First off, it's not a real experiment, just a theory best explained by a hypothetical experiment envisioned by a real scientist. In the hypothetical experiment, a cat is shut inside a box with a radioactive atom, which will emit an alpha particle upon it's decay. A geiger counter inside the box will register the alpha particle, and an apparatus of some sort connected to it will activate a hammer that will break a vial of some sort of horrible deadly chemical, which will kill the cat. (At this point, I can imagine your relief that it is only a theoretical experiment.) Now, to understand the implications of this, you have to know about quantum wave theory.
Quantum wave theory basically says that when you are measuring the actions of subatomic particles, their actions don't become "real" until they are observed. In the cat experiment, this correlates by the decay of the radioactive particle. Until you open that box to determine the state of that particle, it exists in a state of duality at the same time -- it has decayed, and it is still stable. This would also translate to all of the events that are linked to the particle -- remember that there is a geiger counter that, upon measuring the alpha particle emitted at the particle's decay, will activate a hammer that will smash the vial of poison, that will kill the cat. The experiment really was hypothesized to show the absurdity of the whole field of quantum physics, because if their ideas were true then the cat would be in a state of being alive and being dead at the same time, clearly impossible.
Okay, if you have made it to this sentence, you must have laboured through that science lecture. I left a whole shitload out, but that is basically it from my best understanding. Maybe Dean or Apl can explain better if you're for some reason still inclined to want to know.
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
Douglas Adams |
|
|
|
Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 02:51:27
|
| Is this tied into stories like the mom who lifts a tractor trailer off her pinned kid? |
|
|
|
Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 07:25:10
|
Couldn't have said it better (and definitely not as succinctly) myself. Nice work, glacial.
"Join the Cult of Frank / And you'll be enlightened" |
|
|
|
apl4eris
~ Abstract Brain ~
USA
4800 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 07:27:57
|
Sounds pretty good to me, but I'm no expert, I can only follow this stuff by the seat of my pants, and the math behind it is beyond my tiny brain's capabilities - sorry I didn't respond sooner, as I was busy obsessing over time travel and RFID like a nincompoop. At least now I have an idea for my next painting, so not all in vain, unless it sucks...
To put it in the simplest terms, it is a distillation of the pervading quandary of a particle vs. wave universe. When observed, a wave is percieved as a particle, when in action, it is known in a wider sense to be a wave. It is the universe's Catch-22 joke on us all.
Here's some sillines about this poor cat from Cecil at Straight Dope. In poem form:
http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_122.html
I think it does tie into the stories about moms and tractor trailers and pinned kids, because the problem is, if the world is soley described by quantum mechanics, why hasn't it collapsed yet? The third state, beyond observed "living" or "dead", is "weird". ;)
>Waxing philosophical BS ahead alert!!!<
...Which is also being used in new computing language, beyond 1 and 0, to yes, no, maybe,... then many maybes. Which brings us to a state of all possibilities at once, which some could call AI, or, "what is", or the principles of a Zen koan.... I just remembered that last night I dreamed about zombies buried in my yard, which is strangely topical....Crap, I'm sorry guys, I've had way too much coffee.
John Bigboote! Look! They have Sweet n Low! |
|
|
|
Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 08:15:08
|
Well, all Schroedinger's stuff basically comes down to really tricky probability. If I remember correctly, he was able to formulate the relations but never solve them. They are very (understatement) complicated at any rate. I think somebody was awarded the Nobel prize for developing a computer program that was actually able to solve them. Maybe I'm thinking of something else, though...
There's nothing like quantum physics to prove we really don't have the slightest clue what's going on at the atomic level. Just look at light: wave, particle, both? I suppose like Einstein's relativity really proved that we have no clue about the complexity of things at a much larger and more observable level. We really don't have a clue about anything, just approximations based on theorizations based on observations.
"Join the Cult of Frank / And you'll be enlightened" |
|
|
|
apl4eris
~ Abstract Brain ~
USA
4800 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 10:14:29
|
My younger brother and I talked about this a while back on AIM - he's in a quantum physics class right now, and I asked him what they were covering at the moment. He goes a bit into some simple math concerning the particle/wave structure of atoms - the conversation is cut up and pasted below, just him (stupid bits by me edited), trying to explain things to his dumb older sis ;):
"This says that electrons and protons and everything are little wave/particles which ends up mathematically working out tricky things like why electrons only exist in quantized orbits and the atom doesnt collapse because only certain wave functions satisfy the needed requirements... and they occur at integer multiples. Well if you have a particle in a box -this is a 1d box for ease- (the height doesnt play in) the wave function has to go to 0 at either end of the box, and sin waves are 0 at 0, pi 2, pi 3, pi blah blah blah, and between those the wave isnt zero at the edges so the particle can have a wave with either 0 1 2 3 4 or 5 pi, but not in between, so it can only exist in those places. the math is a little trickier but thats the idea and each different pi is a different energy so thats how you get those energy levels in atoms. There were lots of problems, but that was one. A guy actually just proposed that things could only exist in certain states just to explain something in radiation, with no reason behind it, and later on they finally explained how it was true."
Hope he doesn't mind me posting this! heheheh |
|
|
|
glacial906
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1738 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 11:24:32
|
I have some sort of deficiency in math, though I've never been tested for it. It sucks, because some types of science (astronomy, quatum physics, cosmology, etc.) are all really interesting to me but I could never have a job in any of these fields because I'm too dumb when it comes to the math involved. (Always done great at English and Art, though!) When I graduated high school in 1997, I had to take Sophomore-level Geometry in summer school before I got my diploma. It sucked! Before I get anywhere in college, I'm going to have to take some developmental math.
Probably I could only manage about the simplest math regarding wave functions and the like. |
|
|
|
the swimmer
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1602 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 11:26:45
|
| My cat's breath smells like cat food. |
|
|
|
Brackish Girl
~ Soul Eater ~
Ireland
1750 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 15:09:39
|
quote:
Originally posted by speedy_m
I you're refering to what I think you're refering to Jessie, you are one dirty, filthy, disgusting girl. I like it.
and where, may i ask mike, have you been?
 "I joined the Cult of Trippy/just pretend that pencil is a joint and the girl has red hair" |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
Topic Locked
