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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
 Posted - 06/04/2003 : 11:32:31
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McDonald's does do some good things I guess, they have the charity and all. But to me, the underlying fact is that their product is detrimental to our health. Same thing with the cornerstones of North America, ie. Coke and Pepsi. There is no nutritional value in it whatsoever, just ask my dentist. They make the tobacco industry (at least try to) admit that smoking is bad for you,(YOU should see our packages in Canada-the whole packs are pictures of cancerous lungs and hearts with strokes and really nasty teeth, they even have a pack that has 2 kids that says 'Please don't poison us', no joke)why can't we have the same warnings on food....
Only if they started with the Sin taxes on food....
Hypocrisy..........
We should have a thread for just me and you blackpurse, oh and merebu too.
If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention. |
Edited by - Carolynanna on 06/04/2003 12:59:32 |
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El Barto
= Song DB Master =
USA
4020 Posts |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2003 : 16:43:19
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I don't agree with the 'detrimental to your health' argument. Everyone is well educated on the healthiness of Coke, Pepsi, McDonalds, and tossed salad - and you choose to eat what you will. It doesn't affect anyone else except you, unless you want to get REALLY anal. If you want to buy it, your body, your choice. I certainly don't want even the best intentioned of people deciding what I can eat, drink, etc., though I do understand that there are limits to such freedoms as there must always be - otherwise, we'd call democracy anarchy.
And I'm not outraged, but I swear I'm paying attention - what gives? |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2003 : 11:01:25
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Obviously you don't have kids Dean, that changes the whole game. You try to tell them that we're not going to the place that has the clown and toys and games etc. because it serves food that is detrimental to your health. Who would be the bad guy then. Same thing with commercials that are aimed at children (especially around Christmas) and how about Blockbuster Video, I can't even take my kids there because there are as many toys as there is movies and someone is gonna have a tantrum.
Not to mention the prices, we hate Walmart, McDonalds etc but damn is it affordable and where are we going to go to, The GAP, not for $50 for a GD t shirt. There are such things as target marketing and such, mix that with the culture we live in and we don't have as much of a choice as you think.
And for the idea that we are all educated in what is detrimental to our health idea, well I smoke and I'm quite aware how bad it is for me but I do it. How many nasty habits do you have and are aware of. Alot of us live in a sort of false conciousness where we can hide from the consequences of our actions.
If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention. |
Edited by - Carolynanna on 06/05/2003 11:02:05 |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2003 : 12:23:21
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Dean, it was just a cool bumper sticker I saw and liked.
If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention. |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2003 : 21:38:55
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| You're definitely right on the me not having kids thing... I hope. :) But there are lots of things that kids want to/like to do but we don't let them because we know better or have the power of reason on our side. Whether it's ingestion of toxic or semi-toxic substances (you might file such items as Elmer's paste, mud, and a Big Mac under this category), standing/playing in precarious locations, or whatever else, the fact is that the real world is full of these sort of no-nos, and you invariably also have to tell your kid(s) not to do this/that even though they want to. It's an adults world, and who would want to live in a kid's one? |
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blackpurse
= Cult of Ray =
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2003 : 05:08:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Cult_Of_Frank
You're definitely right on the me not having kids thing... I hope. :) But there are lots of things that kids want to/like to do but we don't let them because we know better or have the power of reason on our side. Whether it's ingestion of toxic or semi-toxic substances (you might file such items as Elmer's paste, mud, and a Big Mac under this category), standing/playing in precarious locations, or whatever else, the fact is that the real world is full of these sort of no-nos, and you invariably also have to tell your kid(s) not to do this/that even though they want to. It's an adults world, and who would want to live in a kid's one?
Yes, we do have our jobs to do as parents. But there isn't a brightly colored playground on top of that toxic waste dump. A child doesn't see commercials every day urging them to go eat that Elmer's paste. There's not a guy with a toy that you'll get if only you'll join him on the highway meridian.
I have huge free speech issues with banning any kind of advertising (I actually had problems with that whole "remove cartoons from cigarette advertising" thing that pulled Joe Camel off cigarette ads, that's right, we told an american entity -- much as I hate them -- that they cannot use a whole genre of art to convey their message) but I will agree that direct targeted marketing to children, who have not yet developed the critical skills to distinguish good from bad, is evil. That effort, along with peer pressure, makes it very difficult for parents like me (I have a four going on five year old) to teach a child the difference between "Growing Food" and a good treat. There's a REASON we have an obesity problem in this country --- and I'm convinced its habits we developed as children. That problem is especially prevalent with people who were born in my generation and later -- which coincedentally was the same time Ronald McDonald appeared on the scene. Problem was, my parents (who grew up in the depression and never knew the concept of having "too much food"!) didn't have the training/tools to combat this, and we are just learning today how we as parents can combat this overwheliming direct marketing and peer pressure. I'm proud to say, as I mentioned earlier, that our daughter now says (and believes) "McDonald's is LAME!" but this took a year and a half of deconditioning! In the meantime, as adults, we're given unsatisfying food such that we need everything supersized (for a "bargain price") and we are still listening to our depression and wartime parents who urge us never to pass up a bargain. I dont' know what the answer is. But I will agree that while legal, and while I'll stand up for McDonald's et.al to direct market, its evil evil evil and I hate them for it.
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2003 : 13:22:32
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I read that people who play the current 'Ronald's' cannot disclose what they do for a living...
This is probably because one of the first people to play Ronald is now a vegetarian and goes around telling kids about the evils of McD.
Ha ha!! |
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Arm Arm Arm
* Dog in the Sand *
1036 Posts |
Posted - 06/07/2003 : 00:04:55
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1--I wouldn't download the album if there was a leak. I can easily wait for the official release. I'm still savoring Black Letter Days and have barely listened to Devil's Workshop. I don't want to gorge myself on FB & the C's; with an artist as prolific as Frank I like to slowly appreciate each album.
2--Read Fast Food Nation for a disturbing look at McDonald's.
3--Blackpurse; that's pretty cool that you got your daughter away from Ronald's marketing. |
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Dave Noisy
Minister of Chaos
Canada
4496 Posts |
Posted - 06/07/2003 : 13:49:33
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I don't think the labelling is enough - they need to make major changes of their ingredients. TFA's are brutal, but who the hell knows that?
I think there's going to be mandatory TFA labelling in the US, but it's gonna take some edumacation to get them there ideers out. |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6182 Posts |
Posted - 06/07/2003 : 14:45:34
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aha
a little bit off topic
I Love it!
Because I didn't want to read this topic anymore when Wallmart apeared in it...
(We don't have Wall marts around here so I've got no opinion)
But all of a sudden Ronald McDonald entered the room
WELL SCREW HIM!!!
I hate the whole McDonalds Industry
because:
-Their marketing policy is infact brought to their employees as a religion, if not a Cult! (there are many documentary's about that)There are books filled with crap for managers who want to run a McDonalds and it actually says that you have to devote your life to it. It's a little bit too much I think, but from an economic prospect
it's very reasonable I guess, so it's not a really big deal. But it's something I would never be comfortable with as an employee.
-The employees don't have rights, in Holland (and all over the world off course, but I'm not sure about that) we have Unions for every worksector except Mcdonalds. That means that Mcmanagers can fire employees when they want to, without a single reason and the fired- person can't complain about it or whatsoever. Mcdonalds doesn't want a Employee-Union just because it costs money
-Bio-industry: simply the reason why I don't eat meat. Not because
it's wrong to eat animals or kill animals, that's nature I think. But holding animals who don't have any space or sunlight is unhealthy and against nature. Mcdonalds is the number one company who contributes to the Bio Industry. Did you know that it even affects the rainforrest's?
-Nutrition: see other messages about that
and I do forget a lot
''it's not a box, it's a submarine'' |
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Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 06/07/2003 : 19:31:50
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| Jop, unions are the devil, and good for McDonalds if they don't have a union. Too many problems in my country from greedy unions/leaders who stir up the pot regularly just to soak out more than they're worth and let the people who pay their agregious dues and salaries know that they're there. As long as Holland protects human rights, what are unions really for? These people have the same rights that everyone has, whether in a union, at a small store, or whatever. Anyway, I hate unions as much as Walmart and homogenized corporate multinats. They're one and the same to me - though they both serve some purpose in the scheme of things and even do some good things, it takes a bit more than that to make them 'good'. |
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billgoodman
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Netherlands
6182 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2003 : 04:20:25
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ok
we don't have the same opinion about that
there are a lot of wrong Unions I know
but McDonalds have a killer instinct when it comes to handling
their workers. For instance they say that they employ the most
foreigners in Holland and help to decline the number of unemployed foreigners.(I hate to call them foreigeners uhm let's call then immigrants if that's more politically correct)
But they also fire most of them, because there are enough of them
for every immigrant there's another one, you see. So the ones who get the job and lose it after one silly mistake (there's no knowledge why people are fired, because Mcdonalds can do it when they want to, I'm not saying that you can't fire them or always have to give them another change, but Mcdonalds don't give inside information about it
so they can fire people when they want to) will have more trouble to find another job and stuff.
That's not good for the system that only makes it worse
''it's not a box, it's a submarine'' |
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Carolynanna
>> Denizen of the Citizens Band <<
Canada
6556 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2003 : 09:14:59
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| Dean, I would be curious to hear a little bit more about the evil union thing. Do you think that people get a fairer go non-union? |
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speedy_m
= Frankofile =
Canada
3581 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2003 : 14:12:23
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| There are certainly postives and negatives to unions. Either way, when any group (a corporation, a union, et al) get's too large or attempts to have to much control/power, it's not a good thing. Unions have served a good purpose in the past and will continue to do so in the future, they will also cause a lot of problems and make people's lives difficult. It's all really explained best by the facotry worker fired by Burns's father on the Simpsons. |
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jasun
- FB Fan -
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2003 : 16:33:48
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i downloaded it.
its fantastic.
i will buy it. |
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Bohemoth
- FB Fan -
USA
246 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2003 : 20:49:51
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| Unions are a must if you don't want to be fierd because your boss don't like people with brown hair. or drive a ford |
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Bohemoth
- FB Fan -
USA
246 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2003 : 21:15:33
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| Actuallt here in WV (I don't know about anywhere else). it is completly legal for your NON-UNION company to fire you if Joe Blow walks in and says "I'll do that guy over theres job for 2 dollors less an hour. If you fire him and hire me". I've seen it happen. but of course here if you make 7 bucks an Hour your considered upper middle class. Don't get me started on why union is a must!!! unless its a short term job or summer job. my company forced the union out when all the older employees who had been there longer eventually moved out of state to find better Paying jobs. the New young domb full of cum, employees decided to vote out the union because the company promised a Quarter more an hour if the majority voted the union out. after the union was voted out a month later they took 200 hours of paid vacation time that we were able to acumulate a year away from us and droped us 3 hours a week and said no more anual raises and nobody has gotten a raise for over 2 years!!! (enter sarcasm) but we did get that 25 cent an hour raise. Boy did we get screwed. only if we had the union back |
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