| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
gvil
- FB Fan -
15 Posts |
 Posted - 04/06/2003 : 22:43:20
|
I didn't know where else to post this so here goes. How does Frank write his tunes? Does he write the music 1st or the lyrics? Is there a formula he uses? I've been playing the FB tunes and other musicians music but I still have no idea how to conjur up a tune. Does anyone here write their own music? I'd like to be able to listen to artists like FB and others and be able to write some tunes of my own. Any ideas where to start?  |
|
|
El Barto
= Song DB Master =
USA
4020 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2003 : 00:23:57
|
| I believe he mainly writes the music first, then the lyrics. It comes naturally...it's not something you can really force. Sometimes you'll just be jamming on a riff and you'll come out with something, then say "oh this would sound good for a chorus" and just piece it together. Sometimes you think of a lyrical melody and put music behind it, then put words to it. It just all really falls together, like, it just feels right. I've written music, but I've had long periods of writer's block. Just now I'm getting back into it...I'll just jam on the guitar or bass and come up with something and record it...go back over it later. Sometimes I just bang out the music to a song within an hour. I'll have the full music and maybe some rough lyrics or melodies. Sometimes I just get these bouts of inspiration. The lyrics are like poetry, like a story...to write 'good' lyrics, you gotta be good at both of those. Start by writing a song with a subject you're familiar with. Write the way your personality is...I tend to write a lot of really sarcastic stuff, cause I'm super sarcstic...it's just easier that way. Hope I've provided some help. |
 |
|
|
haki
- FB Fan -
14 Posts |
Posted - 04/08/2003 : 07:13:09
|
| I know frank has stated in more that one interview that music always comes first (see the interview topic in general fb chat). |
|
|
|
PsychicTwin
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1772 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2003 : 15:26:56
|
gvil-
These days, I find some kind of recording medium (anything from an 8-track to a little tape deck) invaluable in writing songs. A lot of times I'll come up with fragments, a riff here and there, and some of my songs are simply a composite of those sporadic moments in time. Then, there will be the (very rare) occassion where inspiration perches upon my shoulder and I belt out a tune that pretty much writes itself.
As far as lyrics go...that is probably the hardest part for me. I have lately been trying (maybe it's Frank's influence) to make my songs more about something concrete than the jumble of fragmented ideas that usually piece together my lyrics. For me, I always write the lyrics after the music.Don't be fooled...songwriting is hard work (writing *good* songs, that is) and like anything else you get better at it with practice. You find what motivates you, what inspires you, and what simply turns you off. I think the hardest part of it all is finding your 'voice' or 'style', something that is a composite of your influences but unique and personalized at the same time...
Songwriting is not easy! Even though badasses like Frank make it seem so. And collaborating with other musicians on a song...shaping and molding it...that takes chemistry that can be very hard to find.
|
|
|
|
vegan
- FB Fan -
USA
64 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2003 : 14:17:46
|
| Back when the Pixies were together, I heard, from more than one source, that Frank would smoke pot and stare into the mirror and write songs (lyrics?) I was in high school at the time and thus a little naive. However, he is known for having a fondness of marijuanna so it is not altogether too incredible to believe. |
|
|
|
Broken Face
-= Forum Pistolero =-
USA
5155 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2003 : 15:03:38
|
lately, like el barto, i've been coming back to songwriting after a stint of writers block that lasted the better part of the last school year. i find the best way to write is to get inspired, but thats something you can't force. when i see a great show, have a really interesting conversation, etc. i feel its must easier to write. also, like psychic twin, i find my 8 track absolutley neccesary in remembering/organizing ideas. lyrics, for me, usually stem out of a line i'll come up with and then a building off of that one original line. songwriting is a very hard thing to do well, and even if a song "comes out easily" it still takes a good deal of work, at least for me, to make it a complete work. and practice definetely helps, my songs i've been writing recently i feel are my strongest ever.
-brian |
|
|
|
Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2003 : 16:02:07
|
| I keep a little green book which I take around with me and whenever an idea pops into my head, or a cool lyric, or anything like that, I throw it in the book. Until I got the book, I'd been using scrap paper, but it's good to have somewhere where all your thoughts and ideas can be found. Plus you don't have a pile of paper ala me to deal with. The computer is also a good place to keep finished lyrics and maybe even scanned stuff (artwork, etc). Not that I'm a writing veteran or even all that good at it... |
|
|
|
killmocker
- FB Fan -
Japan
41 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2003 : 14:06:36
|
HOW FRANK WRITES SONGS:
Direct quote from Pixie days:
"I write my songs mostly in front of a mirror.
When I get tired of the mirror, I stand in the bath tub and draw the shower curtain. Eighty percent of the lyrics are baloney. It's that T. Rex thing of 'it sounds cool'. I write songs by singing a whole bunch of syllables to chord progressions and they become words. A bunch of five words might mean something or stand for something, but the five words after it, or preceding it sure as hell won't have anything to do with them".
-Frank Black (or Black Francis or whatever)
I assume his songwriting approach might have changed over the years. The main thing I think is he does music 1st then words.
TIP: For writing YOUR own songs, write the letters ABCDEFG on a piece of paper. Close your eyes and
point to a bunch randomly. These will be your chords in the song. Now write lyrics, and presto! A new song.
(I can't guarantee it will sound good though)
|
|
|
|
mkingicus
- FB Fan -
USA
68 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2003 : 11:58:09
|
I have a hard time writing sometimes, because I'm always comparing myself to Mr. Black, which is good and bad.
Good - it pushes me to try and be as good as I can.
Bad - how is a 17 year old supposed to stack up to Frank Black? I may be a little hard on myself sometimes, as my friends would say.
But most of the time I write a song about something that interests me, such as one of my best, about our ignorance toward the lady bugs we step on all of the time but fail to take into consideration that we have just taken a life, and that it would suck if it happened to you. The reason the song is good (to me) is because if you read the lyrics, you won't ever know that that is what I am talking about. You just have to be creative, try to break away from the, "oh, my girlfriend left me and stuff" songs plaguing the radio and write about something DIFFERENT. Sometimes the song structure gives me a hard time, too. But I'm trying to learn how to play the piano at the moment to add another view to my musical plane. All in all, just give it time and space (and don't get toooooo frustrated) and, it might just fall into place by itself. Good luck!
M King |
|
|
|
Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2003 : 17:26:19
|
| Lyrics derive beauty from depth and meaning- otherwise, they're just a group of words that you happened to put together. Or they've been said a million times, the same way. I do agree with you that you don't want to just say everything directly, because there's no art in that - at least not all the time. Some things call for the direct approach. |
|
|
|
NimrodsSon
* Dog in the Sand *
USA
1938 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2003 : 19:11:25
|
I used to just write a bunch of words that made absolutely no sense, but after I've started listening to the beach boys lately, I've discovered the true beauty in just writing love songs, and that has completely changed my writing style. I've also started to actually do true chord progressions that go with scales instead of just playing a bunch of chords, but if you want to just randomly play chords, another way besides what killmocker suggested is to draw a fretboard on a piece of paper with the low E and A strings and draw criss-crossing patterns all over the place and each place you land will be the bass note for the chord. I have actually come up with some cool sounding chord progressions this way, but now I'm starting to do things a lot more proffesional.
I've started carrying a thing of post-it notes and a pen to write down lyrics that I come up with just like Cult Of Frank, but that still doesn't help me when I come up with great melodies in my head and forget them when I finally get to the piano or guitar, so I have debated for a while buying one of those minicassette recorders to carry in my pocket so I can record the melodies that I come up with. |
|
|
|
Cult_Of_Frank
= Black Noise Maker =
Canada
11687 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2003 : 20:06:42
|
| Well, that's pretty cool. The minicassette recorder's a great idea. For myself, I when I get a melody line in my head, I write it down as a series of horizontal lines (except for scales, which are diagonal). The longer the line, the longer the note/chord is held, and a line above means higher pitch, and one below means lower. Kind of a lame system, basically like actual musical notation without the theory/overhead, but I've saved a melody/lead or two from vanishing into oblivion. Of course, it does rely on the gist of the melody coming back to you, so I have also lost a few this way, but it's better than nothing. Maybe it'll help until you get one? I have been in a lull for actual music popping in my head lately, but I think I may also pick up a recorder if my muse awakens.... |
|
|
|
El Barto
= Song DB Master =
USA
4020 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2003 : 14:29:18
|
| The Beach Boys really do affect songwriting, I swear. I've been listening to them regularly for about 2 years now and my songwriting has turned into actually songwriting. When it comes to remembering songs and lyrics and melodies that pop into my head randomly, I have a sort of mental filter. I figure, if the song is good then it's worth remembering, and I'll remember it. It works out pretty well! |
|
|
|
ericr
- FB Fan -
USA
33 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2003 : 20:48:09
|
Just pretend you're one of your favorite musicians, take something that sounds mildly amusing and play it like it's 100 times more serious and stylized than it really is. After a while, you're methods and techniques will form habits, sooner or later you have a definitive sound of your own...at that point you can just write a song by doing an egotistical impression of yourself playing one of your new songs that you've been dying to hear.
Start with the guitar, build around that. Let the words form based on sounds, then just chisel and tweak the best fitting meanings to whatever comes naturally. Lyrical inspiration rarely comes when you're trying to write music. It happens when your taking a shit at work, washing dishes, driving by yourself, etc., so when attractive word-combos occur to you, write them on the back of ATM receipts, drop them in a shoebox for later. When it's time to pu in the lyrics, you'll be amazed at how easy it is.
Eric R.
http://puerco.iuma.com |
|
|
|
miguel
- FB Fan -
USA
213 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2003 : 02:23:16
|
| I have always just sat down in front of my computer and started recording. I guess I tend to focus on sound rather than story telling. My music gravitates towards instrumental stuff but when there are lyrics, it's very spontaneous and totally influenced by the music. I've always thought of the way I do things as musical sketching, I write and record the same way I draw. |
|
|
|
lippincott
- FB Fan -
11 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2003 : 06:27:48
|
I will second Broken Face comments about getting inspired. I can languish with a piece of music for weeks, just fiddling after work...blahblahblah. Then I will read a great passage in a book, do a good hike, hear a great new song, and get home inspired, go out in the balcony and viola it just falls togther. Listening to music is sometimes a similar process.
Also, I find that the most meaningful lyrics come from personal experience. Not just blatant "I broke up with Susan, doowop doowop" stuff. But things that are meaningful expressed as metaphors and in interesting ways. although the direct method works for a lot of musicians to.
|
|
|
|
Little Black Francis
> Teenager of the Year <
3648 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2003 : 20:51:50
|
for me, every song is pretty much different. I've got like 23 or something close to that I feel confident about playing.
I know for me it's the same as with most people. It's nearly impossible to just sit down and decide to write a song. It's not a menial task. Most of my songs have just happened. Sometimes it's lyrics, sometimes it music, but always just an idea.
I wrote a couple songs just by getting stoned and turning on my 4-track and just making shit up, then I went back and transcribed everything I said onto the computer, and then took the best parts and made a song. One song I wrote, the jam in the middle is something I used to play in college like 8 years ago.
Mostly for me, it's a feeling that begins it all. And then I try to make chords that convey that feeling, and then the lyrics usually fall into place. Sometimes they make sense, sometimes they can be esoteric.
It really is a strange process.
I need to use my libel more too CultofFrank, except mine has dolphins swimming through space. I got it from walmart. Iz pretty cool.
Good topic, it will never be exhausted.
ain't it |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
Topic Locked
