| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| leon993 |
Posted - 04/26/2014 : 13:28:05
I can't help to find most of the new Pixies songs kinda boring. Where is the quietness and blazing choruses, the hallmark of Pixies v. 1? I cannot help to think (now), that it was Kim who brought this into BF's songs, and with her gone, Pixies is gone as well. BF's songs are good, no question about it, but they are missing this edge, which I think Kim delivered. What are your thoughts about this? |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Joey Joe Jo Jr. Chabadoo |
Posted - 05/06/2014 : 06:38:25
quote:
Originally posted by billgoodman
And now in the new Mojo interview (great, great article):
BF: 'I want to be edgy, I want to fail - or at least take a chance, to fail through trying to go somewhere'
---------------------------
BF: Mag ik Engels spreken?
But wasn't it exactly what he did in the last 20 years?
It's not as if it was new for him to "try" something new.
Going back to the topic, it seems that Kim Deal was merely the lucky charm of the Pixies as Black Francis himself stated some years ago.
No matter what is responsible for what, there are rules, like divine geometry you can't escape. The Pixies miracle was part of this.
May they learn and us along...
++++ |
| billgoodman |
Posted - 05/06/2014 : 00:04:30
And now in the new Mojo interview (great, great article):
BF: 'I want to be edgy, I want to fail - or at least take a chance, to fail through trying to go somewhere'
---------------------------
BF: Mag ik Engels spreken? |
| Helmut |
Posted - 05/03/2014 : 00:41:04
Kim and Dave were facilitators to Charle's songwriting genius and Joey's schizo guitar. The latter two are 80% of the Pixies sound. |
| Fissile |
Posted - 05/02/2014 : 10:51:02
quote:
Originally posted by billgoodman
It's a paradox in a way. Kim was the one with the big crossover hit (Canonball, Last Splash) and Frank was the one who was less succesful but is always taking chances, doing something new. It would be nice if people would give Frank some kudos for trying to be fresh (a rock opera about a dutch singer, a score to a silent movie). And maybe critics should be just as hard on Kim for not writing another Canonball or Gigantic as on Frank for not writing another Gouge Away.
---------------------------
BF: Mag ik Engels spreken?
Thompson has a radio face....very little personal charisma. In the video based music scene of the 90s that was career poison, even if the songs were compelling.
When Kim did last Splash she and Kelley were cute, hip and goofy at the same time, they had endearing personalities, it's no wonder they became the darlings of MTV.
Fast forward 20 years, both are well into middle age. Now people appreciate Thompson's song writing talents, while Kim & Kelley get little attention after turning into weird old cat-ladies. In short, it never was about Kim's songs, they didn't stand the test of time while Thompson's songs have. |
| IBreed |
Posted - 05/01/2014 : 18:16:30
quote:
Originally posted by billgoodman
Kim is the coolest of the four, but that has more to do with myth than fact. It's all in the eye (or ear) of the beholder.
She arranged Bagboy? I think it has the weakest structure of the record, probably the weakest of all the pixies songs.
The verses don't built up to the chorus, the chorus comes out of nowhere, the song is very repetitive and goes on forever.
The beats are also very lame.
I could go on and on and (here it comes) it's not even a weak song. It's a good riff, has good lyrics.
But that's not even my point. I love Kim and especially her recent work. I turn to Kim for some nice unpolished songs. She makes the same record every 5-10 years. Pod, Title Tk, Pacer, Mountain Battles, the new singles, they all have the same throwaway quality in a way. It always sounds like she's just coming up with these tunes in your own living room. Only Last Splash was different, in my book. They are all cool, they all sound like Kim couldn't give a fuck. While we all know she does. A lot. She spends ages crafting her records.She likes to work slow and only releases something if it's 100% good. Which doesn't mean that most mainstream listeners think her records sound good (some hiss, some mistakes, weird mixing, out of tune singing).
I turn to BF for some new shit, for some new way of looking at his art. His typical lyrics and chords are always there, but it always turns out in a new way. Teenager Of The Year is not Honeycomb and both don't sound like Bluefinger or Dog In The Sand. Some records are great, some are a bit weaker. Frank likes the work fast.
I love both for who they are and what they do and what keeps their motor running. But let me tell you one thing: professional critics need something 'fresh' of 'cool' to write about and to sell their magazines or websites to the public. You can't write in superlatives about a new Frank record every year. It's way easier to applaude Kims work. It only comes around every once in a while and it more or less sounds the same as her classic work. She doesn't have to compete that much with her past work. Frank does. Nobody will say that Walking With A Killer is bad because it's not Debaser, but Franks new songs will always be compared with his classics. Especially now that he's working with the Pixies again.
It's a paradox in a way. Kim was the one with the big crossover hit (Canonball, Last Splash) and Frank was the one who was less succesful but is always taking chances, doing something new. It would be nice if people would give Frank some kudos for trying to be fresh (a rock opera about a dutch singer, a score to a silent movie). And maybe critics should be just as hard on Kim for not writing another Canonball or Gigantic as on Frank for not writing another Gouge Away.
---------------------------
BF: Mag ik Engels spreken?
bagboy isn't even a good riff though. the arrangement is entirely what makes that song work or not work for people. basically no one is going to champion any one individual component of that tune (unlike every other song on the record save for perhaps jamie bravo) because any part on its own is essentially nothing, musically speaking.
i've always been a champion of bagboy as an awesome performance piece but not a great song.
also, every criticism you levelled at bagboy strikes me as an aspect i enjoy about the band and have enjoyed in the past... i get what you mean, but the pixies were always jarring in their writing. particularly the early stuff. they had moments of genuine smooth pop, but they always fell as the exception rather than the rule (the reverse is true on indie cindy). 
|
| Sprite |
Posted - 05/01/2014 : 12:12:49
Agree 100%. When I heard that Boom demo I basically cringed and thought losing Kim may be majorly unfortunate but lose Joey and its game over, immediately. |
| OLDMANOTY |
Posted - 05/01/2014 : 11:39:08
'No Kim, no Deal' has become a tedious meme hasn't it. But it makes no sense to me. Now, if it was Joey who'd left the naysayers would have a point. |
| natenate101 |
Posted - 05/01/2014 : 04:50:36
Some good points being made. To me, they all made the Pixies what they are.
Just a thought...Never underestimate a man, or men, also thriving off the presence of a woman to try and impress. I'm sure just Kim being such a talented woman in the band with the 3 men elevated things. Not to mention being a solid songwriter as well. That energy may have been lacking in these sessions.
But really, the collective just had some magic. I'm not sure it can be broken down into elements. It just happened.
As for today, they are adults who have lived lives and now make the music they make. It's still special, just different.
I really think the "No Kim, No Deal" thing is kinda corny, but I get the sentiment.
Also, both BF and Kim have made some less than stellar songs since then, it's not like either are batting 1.000. They probably need each other more than anyone cares to mention. |
| Ziggy |
Posted - 05/01/2014 : 00:47:22
quote:
Originally posted by billgoodman
Kim is the coolest of the four, but that has more to do with myth than fact. It's all in the eye (or ear) of the beholder.
She arranged Bagboy? I think it has the weakest structure of the record, probably the weakest of all the pixies songs.
The verses don't built up to the chorus, the chorus comes out of nowhere, the song is very repetitive and goes on forever.
The beats are also very lame.
I could go on and on and (here it comes) it's not even a weak song. It's a good riff, has good lyrics.
But that's not even my point. I love Kim and especially her recent work. I turn to Kim for some nice unpolished songs. She makes the same record every 5-10 years. Pod, Title Tk, Pacer, Mountain Battles, the new singles, they all have the same throwaway quality in a way. It always sounds like she's just coming up with these tunes in your own living room. Only Last Splash was different, in my book. They are all cool, they all sound like Kim couldn't give a fuck. While we all know she does. A lot. She spends ages crafting her records.She likes to work slow and only releases something if it's 100% good. Which doesn't mean that most mainstream listeners think her records sound good (some hiss, some mistakes, weird mixing, out of tune singing).
I turn to BF for some new shit, for some new way of looking at his art. His typical lyrics and chords are always there, but it always turns out in a new way. Teenager Of The Year is not Honeycomb and both don't sound like Bluefinger or Dog In The Sand. Some records are great, some are a bit weaker. Frank likes the work fast.
I love both for who they are and what they do and what keeps their motor running. But let me tell you one thing: professional critics need something 'fresh' of 'cool' to write about and to sell their magazines or websites to the public. You can't write in superlatives about a new Frank record every year. It's way easier to applaude Kims work. It only comes around every once in a while and it more or less sounds the same as her classic work. She doesn't have to compete that much with her past work. Frank does. Nobody will say that Walking With A Killer is bad because it's not Debaser, but Franks new songs will always be compared with his classics. Especially now that he's working with the Pixies again.
It's a paradox in a way. Kim was the one with the big crossover hit (Canonball, Last Splash) and Frank was the one who was less succesful but is always taking chances, doing something new. It would be nice if people would give Frank some kudos for trying to be fresh (a rock opera about a dutch singer, a score to a silent movie). And maybe critics should be just as hard on Kim for not writing another Canonball or Gigantic as on Frank for not writing another Gouge Away.
---------------------------
BF: Mag ik Engels spreken?
Excellent post. |
| billgoodman |
Posted - 04/30/2014 : 21:19:37
Kim is the coolest of the four, but that has more to do with myth than fact. It's all in the eye (or ear) of the beholder.
She arranged Bagboy? I think it has the weakest structure of the record, probably the weakest of all the pixies songs.
The verses don't built up to the chorus, the chorus comes out of nowhere, the song is very repetitive and goes on forever.
The beats are also very lame.
I could go on and on and (here it comes) it's not even a weak song. It's a good riff, has good lyrics.
But that's not even my point. I love Kim and especially her recent work. I turn to Kim for some nice unpolished songs. She makes the same record every 5-10 years. Pod, Title Tk, Pacer, Mountain Battles, the new singles, they all have the same throwaway quality in a way. It always sounds like she's just coming up with these tunes in your own living room. Only Last Splash was different, in my book. They are all cool, they all sound like Kim couldn't give a fuck. While we all know she does. A lot. She spends ages crafting her records.She likes to work slow and only releases something if it's 100% good. Which doesn't mean that most mainstream listeners think her records sound good (some hiss, some mistakes, weird mixing, out of tune singing).
I turn to BF for some new shit, for some new way of looking at his art. His typical lyrics and chords are always there, but it always turns out in a new way. Teenager Of The Year is not Honeycomb and both don't sound like Bluefinger or Dog In The Sand. Some records are great, some are a bit weaker. Frank likes the work fast.
I love both for who they are and what they do and what keeps their motor running. But let me tell you one thing: professional critics need something 'fresh' of 'cool' to write about and to sell their magazines or websites to the public. You can't write in superlatives about a new Frank record every year. It's way easier to applaude Kims work. It only comes around every once in a while and it more or less sounds the same as her classic work. She doesn't have to compete that much with her past work. Frank does. Nobody will say that Walking With A Killer is bad because it's not Debaser, but Franks new songs will always be compared with his classics. Especially now that he's working with the Pixies again.
It's a paradox in a way. Kim was the one with the big crossover hit (Canonball, Last Splash) and Frank was the one who was less succesful but is always taking chances, doing something new. It would be nice if people would give Frank some kudos for trying to be fresh (a rock opera about a dutch singer, a score to a silent movie). And maybe critics should be just as hard on Kim for not writing another Canonball or Gigantic as on Frank for not writing another Gouge Away.
---------------------------
BF: Mag ik Engels spreken? |
| sdon |
Posted - 04/30/2014 : 14:13:23
YES! spot on
Fully agree
--
"Aristophanes! (gong sounds)" |
| IBreed |
Posted - 04/30/2014 : 10:18:45
Kim is probably more an important part of the band today than she was in the latter years of the original run. that's what hurts about her leaving...
obviously Frank is the creative generator. Joey is the one who makes it sound explicitly "pixies". but Kim is like... the good taste arbiter. that's not to say Frank isn't capable of sussing out what's what or blah blah blah, but Kim seems to have become the one that most recognizes what made the band cool (or work, if someone wants to take issue with that terminology). that's even more clear now that we've found out she vouched for silver snail, indie cindy, greens, ring the bell, what goes boom and more or less arranged bag boy to what it is today.
i'd love it if Kim helped the band in the studio next release. arrangements, song selection, etc.
|
| Sprite |
Posted - 04/30/2014 : 00:18:01
With the exception of one infamous poster there is more kimchi than kim-hate on this site |
| Arm Arm Arm |
Posted - 04/29/2014 : 15:09:14
I haven't seen "kim hate". I think some are disappointed she didn't go ahead with the new recordings, but most people just seem to be reacting to the songs, as well as praising Paz's performances. |
| simibaby |
Posted - 04/29/2014 : 14:08:52
sell |
| simibaby |
Posted - 04/29/2014 : 14:08:19
Agree re: Frank being the man the force the genius behind the music. But
what's with all the "Kim -hate" that seems to go around here lately? Fuck all that. BTW the Breeders DO put on great shows and DO seel out all the time (albeit smaller venues) |
| billgoodman |
Posted - 04/28/2014 : 03:53:40
The question alone is very insulting to Joey and Dave, btw.
To me Joey's axe is more important than anything.
---------------------------
BF: Mag ik Engels spreken? |
| Arm Arm Arm |
Posted - 04/27/2014 : 12:07:40
I think Kim is an essential part of the Pixies; her voice and her bass playing as well as the chemistry she brought; but Frank is the songwriter, from him sprung the brilliance of Where is My Mind and Motorway and on and on. His songwriting genius as performed by all of them is the Pixies, but no matter how greatly I value Kim, without Frank there is no Pixies. Did she have an important part to play, yes, of course. Was it Kim who made the Pixies? No. |
| BLT |
Posted - 04/27/2014 : 11:07:58
"Overrated but brilliant"? I've never heard her referred to as greater than brilliant, especially around here lately. |
| natenate101 |
Posted - 04/27/2014 : 10:12:27
quote:
Originally posted by Oui
Overrated but brilliant musician. All four were what made the Pixies great but a heavy burden on Francis writing the songs.
Pretty much. |
| Oui |
Posted - 04/27/2014 : 08:01:02
Overrated but brilliant musician. All four were what made the Pixies great but a heavy burden on Francis writing the songs.
|
| sdon |
Posted - 04/27/2014 : 06:47:55
OP, have you heard the demos on Frank Black Francis
That was the seed for all Pixies songs, with or without Kim
--
"Aristophanes! (gong sounds)" |
| billgoodman |
Posted - 04/26/2014 : 19:31:19
Kim was and is also good for hipster credit.
But no, listen to Bam Thwok and compare it with the new stuff
---------------------------
BF: Mag ik Engels spreken? |
| The Champ |
Posted - 04/26/2014 : 18:34:41
Kim is a great singer. The whatever's were lucky to have her; without question. But her contributions, artistically, ended in 1989. |
| Fissile |
Posted - 04/26/2014 : 15:46:40
quote:
Originally posted by leon993
I can't help to find most of the new Pixies songs kinda boring. Where is the quietness and blazing choruses, the hallmark of Pixies v. 1? I cannot help to think (now), that it was Kim who brought this into BF's songs, and with her gone, Pixies is gone as well. BF's songs are good, no question about it, but they are missing this edge, which I think Kim delivered. What are your thoughts about this?
Kelley?
No, Kim was not responsible for the loud-quiet-loud dynamic on the Pixies' original albums. Thompson had that worked out before he found Kim. Kim's contribution to the band was her strange bass lines and her baby-girl vocals. Besides, why should the current album sound like the originals? Artists grow and change. I think we're going to hear more interesting things to come from the Pixies in the near future, and it's Kim's loss.
BTW, the Pixies are currently selling out big venues. How about the Breeders?
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