| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| johnnyribcage |
Posted - 10/19/2007 : 19:15:16
I posted this topic on the Making Noise forum a little bit ago and realized it belongs on this forum instead...
After some initial flurries and building excitement via one or two paragraph teasers in the big mags and websites, including some good reviews, I'm very disappointed with Bluefinger's lack of splash in the music scene. I'm baffled.
This album really had/has the potential to return The Man to a truly relevant status as an artist at the forefront of modern music. In my opinion, he's always been there, but this one just has that... It.
I've been keeping an eye on the amazon reviews and such, and it just seems to have stalled out a month or two after the official release.
Why?
This album deserves the recognition slathered on the Pixies albums for sure, but where is it? Shit, he's even using the old name. The Pixies tours all sold out. The DVD's sold like hotcakes. Is it the fans? Is it the lack of promotion? Is it the lack of media coverage? Lack of radio play? Put Captain Pasty or Test Pilot Blues on the radio for awhile and see what happens - people WILL dig it.
I blame all these things.
I don't want to come across as sounding shallow, but this guy needs to be on the cover of Rolling Stone for this album. In a way, I love being part of "the club", the insiders that really know how great all of his work is, and how in a weird way it might somehow take away from that feeling if Frank/Charles/Black were more recognized. At the same time, I wear a Frank Black and the Catholics shirt out on a Friday night proud and true, and praying that someone will recognize the name and strike up a conversation about his music. Other than this forum, I'm really starving for some intelligent conversation about how fantastic his music is.
Sorry to sound bitchy here, but I think it's maybe a relevant topic to start up.
I love this part... Yeah, we did it! |
| 35 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Grotesque |
Posted - 10/27/2007 : 13:11:47
Why not this one? But it's a rule in pop music since the begining: less than 1% of the artists get all the success! It's like a bet game, isnt it? Why should Frank get the same succes again? It would be like wining the same game twice... very rare actually. Like he said, he's looking for his "walk on the wild side" now, but I think he's closer from writing his "imagine". Yeah, I say that because of the FMRM sound, and I thought "In the time of my ruin" was very close to a potential hit (but it needed a good video by Gondy or something).
Charles needs to move, to do what he wants again and again. You never know where success is coming from, so why trying to take the same way twice? |
| debaserrr |
Posted - 10/26/2007 : 18:46:57
its because people are stupid... no, but it could take a good year to really happen. or it could be more like the pixies where his popularity explodes once hes done. but i dunno, he should be recognized for his whole body of work... whateverrrr... and if my choses where poor i made them...
"The arc of triumph!" |
| johnnyribcage |
Posted - 10/25/2007 : 20:50:09
quote:
Originally posted by debaserrr
but really... can we just concider that charles is just a person who loves making songs and playing music, and for him as the artist, a very good pure artist, he is just doing what he likes, and feels right. maybe not everyone likes softer country melodies, or hard stuff like threshold, but its probobly all just playing ground for him. hes so gifted at it that he probobly doesnt think "im doin a loud album to get me some fame", it probobly just comes out, and he has fun with what comes out, while having fun making it. its a mystery...
"The arc of triumph!"
I agree with you, of course it's all fun for him. If not, we wouldn't have had what he's already done! My intent on my original post was not to question Frank's intentions, but to question the lack of a response to an incredible offering! I hope he continues to have fun and do whatever the hell his heart desires. My problem is with the lack of notice for the Bluefinger album. The question is, WHY IS THIS ONE NOT THE ONE [yet] since it so clearly should be? Sorry, but I don't want to stray from the topic on this one.
I love this part... Yeah, we did it! |
| debaserrr |
Posted - 10/25/2007 : 19:00:47
but really... can we just concider that charles is just a person who loves making songs and playing music, and for him as the artist, a very good pure artist, he is just doing what he likes, and feels right. maybe not everyone likes softer country melodies, or hard stuff like threshold, but its probobly all just playing ground for him. hes so gifted at it that he probobly doesnt think "im doin a loud album to get me some fame", it probobly just comes out, and he has fun with what comes out, while having fun making it. its a mystery...
"The arc of triumph!" |
| debaserrr |
Posted - 10/25/2007 : 14:59:04
the presentation of a song, is everything. imagine green day playing threshold... scary
"The arc of triumph!" |
| johnnyribcage |
Posted - 10/25/2007 : 14:25:24
quote:
Originally posted by Grotesque
There is something strange in Frank ways, I never know if he wants to be famous again (that could partly explain the return to black francis) or if he just wants to do his thing (remember Bluefinger is a very dry album, very close to himself). If I had to bet, I'd say that for him it's just a matter of sound, that there are not a lot of diference between Honeycomb, Bluefinger and Show me your tears if you really listen to the songs and not the package. I'm not very far from reclaiming a come back to the soft vibe (that I think is more his thing these days) but I know a lot of people dont care, they want WOK'N'WOLL with shouts and "loud" guitars (a concept I dont get at all, since you can put the stereo at the volume you want). I'm not HAPPY he came back to an agressive sound, I'm pleased because there are a lot of great songs on Bluefinger, they could be played with just violins and accordeons at a very quiet tempo they'd still be good songs.
Good point, but I think the presentation of some of these songs really make them what they are. I can't imagine Threshold played with the honeycomb gang. And since presentation is so critical to this album, it harkens back more to when Frank was really pulling for fame. That manic delivery hasn't been there in the last few years (granted, it's not on every song on bluefinger). Like you pointed out, the name change is a big sign to me. Also, I remember reading a quote where Frank said something like "if I can't give them Pixies, at least I'll give them Black Francis!"
I love this part... Yeah, we did it! |
| Grotesque |
Posted - 10/24/2007 : 12:28:40
There is something strange in Frank ways, I never know if he wants to be famous again (that could partly explain the return to black francis) or if he just wants to do his thing (remember Bluefinger is a very dry album, very close to himself). If I had to bet, I'd say that for him it's just a matter of sound, that there are not a lot of diference between Honeycomb, Bluefinger and Show me your tears if you really listen to the songs and not the package. I'm not very far from reclaiming a come back to the soft vibe (that I think is more his thing these days) but I know a lot of people dont care, they want WOK'N'WOLL with shouts and "loud" guitars (a concept I dont get at all, since you can put the stereo at the volume you want). I'm not HAPPY he came back to an agressive sound, I'm pleased because there are a lot of great songs on Bluefinger, they could be played with just violins and accordeons at a very quiet tempo they'd still be good songs. |
| solofloyd |
Posted - 10/24/2007 : 11:03:39
88.5 WXPN Philadelphia - http://www.xpn.org/ - announced the release of Bluefinger and played a couple of the songs. It isn't your average radio station though. |
| Carl |
Posted - 10/23/2007 : 06:40:04
Well, I'm thinking of FB's solo career. If FB had the audience of the Pixies, he'd be considered a minor star as a solo artist; I mean, a new Pixies record would certainly get major media coverage.
Of the few Reed albums I've heard, Berlin has a special appeal to me. It's kinda like a concept album/musical soundtrack. Bluefinger reminds me of it, because of the concept thing and the dark European romance of it!!
"A little bit of this, and a little bit of that....trade secrets!" |
| Jefrey |
Posted - 10/22/2007 : 21:20:41
quote:
Originally posted by Carl
quote:
Originally posted by Jefrey
If he really wanted to, I bet he could write a super pop album and become a superstar, but I bet he's loving things as they are. It's frustrating as fans to think that he should have a wider audience, but I think things are about just right.
He has commented before that his circumstances influence his writing and recording, something along the lines of if he was a bigger artist and he had the backing, he'd probably take more time and have a go at producing a really polished album!
quote:
Originally posted by Zsolt G.
When a teenager goes to buy their first Beatles record, they buy Sgt. Peppers, not McCartney's latest, regardless of the fact that it is brand new.
Maybe Bluefinger is Frank's 'Berlin'?! :D
Hmm, interesting. But with the Pixies reunion he played packed festivals to 100,000 people all singing along and basically there to see them more than all the other bands. Is that enough? Or do you think deep down he really wants that platinum record?
And yeah, I guess I bought Velvet Underground & Nico first, even though Transformer is way better.
It's a good point about people like McCartney and Lou Reed. I don't really buy their newer stuff, but I love their earlier work (yes, even Wings - shoot me). I wonder if they have fans like FB fans that will still buy anything they do and give it a chance?
Qu'ils aillent se faire foutre <-- yeah, what he said. |
| Carl |
Posted - 10/22/2007 : 18:16:34
quote:
Originally posted by Jefrey
If he really wanted to, I bet he could write a super pop album and become a superstar, but I bet he's loving things as they are. It's frustrating as fans to think that he should have a wider audience, but I think things are about just right.
He has commented before that his circumstances influence his writing and recording, something along the lines of if he was a bigger artist and he had the backing, he'd probably take more time and have a go at producing a really polished album!
quote:
Originally posted by Zsolt G.
When a teenager goes to buy their first Beatles record, they buy Sgt. Peppers, not McCartney's latest, regardless of the fact that it is brand new.
Maybe Bluefinger is Frank's 'Berlin'?! :D |
| Zsolt G. |
Posted - 10/22/2007 : 13:33:16
When a teenager goes to buy their first Beatles record, they buy Sgt. Peppers, not McCartney's latest, regardless of the fact that it is brand new. I can't think of anybody who has had a late career "comeback record" that has been more successful than what made them popular in the first place. Johnny Cash is kind of like that, but he was never popular with the "kids", until recently, and even that is based on the timelessness of his original output, not so much his cover of NIN. Basically I think you have to accept that Frank has faded from the public conciousness, but the Pixies legacy will live forever. The only way he can regain that kind of spotlight is either to make a really good or really bad pixies record. But honestly, who cares. Frank deservedly cashed inon the Pixies, and can now live comfortably and do whatever he pleases, and the fans can enjoy an intimate performance. |
| fbc |
Posted - 10/22/2007 : 04:21:36
That's it. Thinking about what he has achieved, the man's a success. He's made his living through rock and roll. His 9-5 is making records. His glass is more half full than half empty. |
| Jefrey |
Posted - 10/22/2007 : 01:02:53
quote:
Originally posted by Carl
The thing is, though, Frank does have a real status in the music world. Okay, that's because of The Pixies, but he pretty much wrote everything and was the central personality and voice of the band. It's not too much of an exaggeration to say he almost was The Pixies, or at least the beating heart at the core of them. He wrote just about all the basic music and lyrics, and sang lead on almost every song, imprinting his personality on them. Which is not to undermine the other members, I did say almost. Add Kim's sweet voice and insistent bass, Joey's unique, inspired guitar work and Dave's offbeat drumming to the mix, and that's The Pixies. As a solo artist, FB has been prolific and played countless gigs all over. He's earned his stripes, and has his place in rock history. He's in a position to do as he pleases, without the pressure of hit singles. He manages to get by and play what he wants, and has no use for superstardom. As he said in an interview some years ago "I've got it made in the shade". His back catalgoe will be reassed over the years, and I've no doubt Bluefinger will be praised more widely for the little gem it is.
I think Carl sums it up perfectly. I really feel that other great musicians out there that have name dropped and promoted him are still listening - I bet Bowie, and Bono, and Dave Grohl and tons other respected people still pick up everything he releases.
FB can now do what he wants, pack houses of all different sizes and still lead a good life. He seems to really like doing the small, intimate venues, and being able to walk around said venues without being bothered or even recognized most of the time.
If he really wanted to, I bet he could write a super pop album and become a superstar, but I bet he's loving things as they are. It's frustrating as fans to think that he should have a wider audience, but I think things are about just right.
Qu'ils aillent se faire foutre <-- yeah, what he said. |
| Jefrey |
Posted - 10/22/2007 : 00:53:46
quote:
Originally posted by awestruck
I am ashamed to say that I never even heard of FB or the Pixies until earlier this year. I led a sheltered life.
Anyway, I am baffled at how I have lived all these years and have never heard any songs of his on the radio.
I think people must be deaf to good music or either they are completely in the dark as I was for so long.
It's not you I don't like
Here's how it is. Up till the 90's, radio stations either had DJ's that could play what they wanted if they had enough of a following, or there was a certain number of songs from the "A" list that they were mandated to play, and few songs from the "B" list, which were songs that were voted on by the radio station employees that they had to play per hour. Then they had 3-4 songs that they could pick themselves - that's how and why people tuned into radio shows, to hear what their favorite DJ's wanted to play.
Now all the radio stations are corporate, mostly owned by Clear Channel. The DJ's have absolutely no choice in what to play. Record companies basically pay the stations to pump what they want you to buy down your throat.
There are a few decent independents, but they aren't the type to play Frank Black. KFOG in San Francisco is one - they play a lot of stuff by their own choice, but it's still stuff like KT Tunstell - semi-mainstream adult pop.
In the early 90's, there were plenty of stations playing stuff off TOTY, especially headache. The last song I heard by Frank Black played on the mainstream radio was Men In Black.
It's not his fault, it's just that radio stations have turned to crap. I don't know if his stuff gets played on XM since I don't have it. It seems like there are a few stations that actually have DJ's that get to play what they want on the satellite stations.
It's all pay to play now as far as radio is concerned.
Qu'ils aillent se faire foutre <-- yeah, what he said. |
| johnnyribcage |
Posted - 10/21/2007 : 20:31:34
quote:
Originally posted by awestruck
I am ashamed to say that I never even heard of FB or the Pixies until earlier this year. I led a sheltered life.
Anyway, I am baffled at how I have lived all these years and have never heard any songs of his on the radio.
I think people must be deaf to good music or either they are completely in the dark as I was for so long.
It's not you I don't like
My friend Mr. Awestruck, you have proved my point exactly.
I love this part... Yeah, we did it! |
| awestruck |
Posted - 10/21/2007 : 19:29:13
I am ashamed to say that I never even heard of FB or the Pixies until earlier this year. I led a sheltered life.
Anyway, I am baffled at how I have lived all these years and have never heard any songs of his on the radio.
I think people must be deaf to good music or either they are completely in the dark as I was for so long.
It's not you I don't like
|
| johnnyribcage |
Posted - 10/21/2007 : 13:50:21
quote:
Originally posted by Carl
I know it's a already a bit of a cliche, and I've still not heard the official release (not that there's that much difference?) but kinda feel it's his most enjoyable album in years.
 "In six months, she'll look like Grandma Moses!"
To me, it's without question his most enjoyable release probably since Dog in the Sand, maybe back to Teenager. It's more accessable than both those albums though. It's just got all the great things I love about Frank's music wrapped up in one cool package. But the coverage and exposure has been bubkis. If all those casual Pixies fans out there heard Threshold Apprehension on the radio a couple times, this album would skyrocket in sales. Those casual fans haven't heard it though, and probably never will.
I love this part... Yeah, we did it! |
| vilainde |
Posted - 10/21/2007 : 13:25:34
Strange indeed that it didn't have more success. It didn't even get reviewed in any major newspapers and mags here in France (except a negative review in Rock 'n' Folk - crappy mag). That's really weird. Should've sold millions.
Denis
"Can you hear me? I aint got shit to say." |
| Carl |
Posted - 10/21/2007 : 12:14:29
I know it's a already a bit of a cliche, and I've still not heard the official release (not that there's that much difference?) but kinda feel it's his most enjoyable album in years.
"In six months, she'll look like Grandma Moses!" |
| fbc |
Posted - 10/21/2007 : 05:35:27
Yeah, I do think in certain quarters of the media it's just another record to fall off the Black conveyor belt, another one to compare to his Pixie past. I personally don't think Bluefinger is better than alot of Frank's records, but I can see why some think it has the potential to be the one. What I don't understand is why some of his previous releases, especially certain individual tracks, haven't been "the one".
I guess he's not a major label fan. |
| velvety |
Posted - 10/21/2007 : 05:09:36
Maybe it's the fact that Frank has less and less "story" or mistery around him. He's just a guy in his 40's who releases an album every year. They like albums from a band every four years, big Statements, "we've been locked in a room for 4 years, but we're going to change the world with this album", something they can write about in their little articles. It doesn't matter that Bluefinger is probably his best album since TOTY (which means one of the best albums released this year, period), it's just another Frank Black album. There'll be another next year. |
| fbc |
Posted - 10/21/2007 : 04:46:51
More like whatever happened to the majority of Frank's records?
In that Pixies book they quote 4AD as being as an artistic force rather than a commercial one. I think the same could be said for Frank Black and the Pixies (aswell as countless other influential artists). It's just the way it is. Critical acclaim, not much success.
quote:
"Everywhere we go, we've been overshadowed by bands who've had a lot more success. But you know who gets all the respect?", says Jason Carter, with a knowing grin. The answer inevitable. "Frank Black. He gets the respect. He's the guy that all the big guys are nervous to walk up and talk to".
This quote speaks volumes. |
| Jason |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 22:24:30
I don't know anything and this is 100% pure speculation from a complete nobody outsider who's never even MET Frank, but...
I do theorize that maybe Bluefinger not being a big commercial breakthrough (yet, at least) has largely to do with Frank himself being, to his credit, unwilling to jump through certain hoops that might be required of him to get oh so very prominent. |
| fumanbru |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 19:54:18
ya..it's interesting isn't it. i'm not sure why he doesn't get more radio play. it's great for fans being able to see him in an intimate venue. but i don't think he would object to selling more albums. bluefinger is great and the reviews are pretty good. it should have a place on various record stations. the college station i listen to plays the pixies and lots of new music so i was sure they would be playing bluefinger. i've called in a few time to request it..black francis/ frank black..."huh?...we can play the pixies but don't have any of his solo stuff." sadly to say, i think the music industry has transformed itself to 100% image. the music takes a back seat.
 "I joined the Cult of Frank/ cause I'm a real go-getter!" |
| Pete Egress |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 18:34:33
I felt the same way when Teenager of the Year came out. I only ever heard one song, Calistan, played on a public radio sation just once--that was it from that album. I think for better or for worse, his music just doesnt jive with mainstream, don't know why. Perhaps its becasue Charles Thompson could care less and isnt pushing for that--but who knows. |
| Carl |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 18:23:42
The thing is, though, Frank does have a real status in the music world. Okay, that's because of The Pixies, but he pretty much wrote everything and was the central personality and voice of the band. It's not too much of an exaggeration to say he almost was The Pixies, or at least the beating heart at the core of them. He wrote just about all the basic music and lyrics, and sang lead on almost every song, imprinting his personality on them. Which is not to undermine the other members, I did say almost. Add Kim's sweet voice and insistent bass, Joey's unique, inspired guitar work and Dave's offbeat drumming to the mix, and that's The Pixies. As a solo artist, FB has been prolific and played countless gigs all over. He's earned his stripes, and has his place in rock history. He's in a position to do as he pleases, without the pressure of hit singles. He manages to get by and play what he wants, and has no use for superstardom. As he said in an interview some years ago "I've got it made in the shade". His back catalgoe will be reassed over the years, and I've no doubt Bluefinger will be praised more widely for the little gem it is. |
| OLDMANOTY |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 07:26:21
I'm sure it would be different if there were videos that had any chance of actually being broadcast. I don't think I'll ever see that Tight Black Rubber one tv anytime soon. I suppose it's to do with budgets but it must be a major factor why FB is not as known as he should be. |
| johnnyribcage |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 06:51:02
I didn't say anything about a Frank Black car or ipod commercial. I'd probably puke if I saw that. That's not the point I was trying to make. I don't read Rolling Stone either, I wanted to make a refrence to a big magazine with a big audience - Rolling Stone was the first one I thought of. Sometimes people don't know about something good because they've never heard of it in the first place. I just think it sucks that the only place I can find anyone to BS about FB with is sitting on my couch staring at a computer screen and typing in this box, and Bluefinger has the potential to change that.
I love this part... Yeah, we did it! |
| houstonguthrie |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 05:01:56
quote:
Originally posted by Jefrey
quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage
I don't want to come across as sounding shallow, but this guy needs to be on the cover of Rolling Stone for this album.
I love this part... Yeah, we did it!
Is that what he wants? I don't know. Many many of the most influential artist never achieved much true commercial success. FB's gotten to meet and work with his heroes, he knows he's influential and inspirational to a lot of people, and with the Pixies reunio he got the vindication and money he's deserved.
Do you really want to see FB songs on car commercials? I just heard "Do You Realize?" by Flaming Lips on a Nissan commercial and thought it was just rotten.
I like my favorite artists to make a good living doing the art that entertains us, but I also admire FB for doing things his way. I think it would kind of suck to have bandwagoners. If poeple don't get the music and enjoy it without Rolling Stone or TMZ or whatever telling them that it's cool then they don't deserve it.
Count me in the corner of not wanting him to be any more famous. I feel like it's just right the way it is.
Qu'ils aillent se faire foutre <-- yeah, what he said.
I agree 100% with Jefrey - that's exactly how I feel. I don't want Frank on an ipod commmercial or a car commercial - I was just kidding up above. Well said Jef
|
| treetime |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 01:43:11
Solid Europeon and West Coast Tour. I dig the album. No doubt Rolling Stone would boost sales but is that what he is looking for? I think it reaches the people who are in to it. Not to say I wouldn't read the Rolling Stone, I haven't for years. |
| Jefrey |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 00:11:48
quote:
Originally posted by johnnyribcage
I don't want to come across as sounding shallow, but this guy needs to be on the cover of Rolling Stone for this album.
I love this part... Yeah, we did it!
Is that what he wants? I don't know. Many many of the most influential artist never achieved much true commercial success. FB's gotten to meet and work with his heroes, he knows he's influential and inspirational to a lot of people, and with the Pixies reunio he got the vindication and money he's deserved.
Do you really want to see FB songs on car commercials? I just heard "Do You Realize?" by Flaming Lips on a Nissan commercial and thought it was just rotten.
I like my favorite artists to make a good living doing the art that entertains us, but I also admire FB for doing things his way. I think it would kind of suck to have bandwagoners. If poeple don't get the music and enjoy it without Rolling Stone or TMZ or whatever telling them that it's cool then they don't deserve it.
Count me in the corner of not wanting him to be any more famous. I feel like it's just right the way it is.
Qu'ils aillent se faire foutre <-- yeah, what he said. |
| bobo plenty |
Posted - 10/19/2007 : 23:47:55
I'm torn. I love the fact that coming on twenty years since the first time I saw Frank live, I can still see him at a tiny nightclub at least a couple times year for twenty bucks. On the other hand, he deserves to be selling out huge venues and should get some serious radio airplay. I content myself with the fact that the Pixies reunion tour should put bread on the table for decades to come and allow FB KD JS DL to do what they want. I think that eventually, FB will get the recognition he deserves much like Neil Young has.
|
| Carl |
Posted - 10/19/2007 : 20:15:10
quote:
Originally posted by houstonguthrie
It's going over like gang busters in Uberfan land
Houston, I officially appoint you Bluefinger PR man!
"In six months, she'll look like Grandma Moses!" |
| johnnyribcage |
Posted - 10/19/2007 : 19:58:56
quote:
Originally posted by houstonguthrie
I mean - "Threshold" would've made a great Ipod commercial - but "Gran Mariner and a pocket full of speed - we did it all day until we started to bleed" probably gave the boys sitting around the conference table a little pause - I could see them rubbing their chins on that one
Giving them the benefit of the doubt, I think they all called in sick when the decision was made on the Black Eyed Peas commercial!
I love this part... Yeah, we did it! |
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